IBM and LzLabs to clash in UK court over Software Defined Mainframe
- Reference: 1714126514
- News link: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2024/04/26/ibm_and_lzlabs_uk_trial/
- Source link:
The trial, due to [1]open in the High Court on April 29 , sees IBM taking legal action against Zurich-based LzLabs over its [2]Software Defined Mainframe (SDM) platform. Big Blue's UK arm alleges the Swiss outfit used a subsidiary based in Britain to purchase an IBM mainframe and then reverse-engineered parts of it to enable the development of SDM.
IBM filed a separate [3]lawsuit against LzLabs in a Texas court in 2022, as reported by The Register at the time, but this case is for infringement of patents and misappropriation of trade secrets, although essentially over the same issue. The US case is not expected to come to trial until later this year.
[4]
However, in the Texas [5]court filing [PDF], IBM asserts that the LzLabs subsidiary, Winsopia, was set up by it as a shell entity for the sole purpose of acquiring a license to IBM's mainframe software from IBM UK in order to reverse-engineer it.
[6]
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Big Blue claims the alleged move was unlawful and a breach of its contract terms, which expressly forbid reverse-engineering its products. It is not unusual for license agreements to contain a clause which prohibits or restricts reverse engineering in specific countries.
IBM also claims in the Texas suit that when it discovered the connection between Winsopia and LzLabs, it attempted to exercise its right to audit Winsopia's use of the mainframe software, but reckons this was refused, even though, or so it claims, this was also a license condition.
[8]
It is understood that IBM is seeking damages, along with a ruling from the court that LzLabs used unlawful methods to develop its SDM platform and that it be prevented from selling it to customers.
We asked LzLabs for an official statement regarding the Texas case, but it seems clear that the company aims to contest the claims that Winsopia breached its license agreement terms or that SDM was developed unlawfully.
In the High Court next week
When it comes to the UK case whose trial begins on Monday, The Register understands LzLabs intends to argue that reverse engineering is permitted under UK and EU law for the purposes of creating software compatible with or analogous to the original code, and that IBM is attempting to stifle competition.
SDM was announced by LzLabs in March 2016 as a technology that can enable customers to "move their legacy mainframe applications and data seamlessly to open Linux server and Cloud platforms."
The company claimed at the time that its software solution includes "a faithful re-creation of the primary online, batch and database environments, which enables unrivaled compatibility" and would allow them to dramatically reduce IT costs.
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Part of the cost savings come from not having to rewrite applications to run on newer platforms, as SDM is claimed to allow customer mainframe programs "to operate without changes and without compromise to performance," and "without forcing recompilations of COBOL or PL/1 application programs or making complex changes to the enterprise business environment."
LzLabs has successfully marketed the platform to customers including Rogers Communications, MAN Truck & Bus, and Swiss telecoms operator [10]Swisscom .
All of this could pose a threat to Big Blue, which still derives considerable revenue from its mainframe systems – now branded as IBM Z – and associated services. Many customers are understood to be seeking to move away from their mainframe systems, but the challenges of migrating what may be critical workloads to other platforms has often stymied any such efforts.
[11]IBM sues Micro Focus, claims it copied Big Blue mainframe software
[12]IBM files IP lawsuit against mainframe migration firm
[13]LzLabs kills Swisscom's mainframes – but it's not the work of a vicious BOFH: All the apps are now living on cloud nine
[14]Mainframes are hip now! Compuware fires its dev environment into cloud
IBM also filed a lawsuit in 2022 against another IT company, [15]Micro Focus , claiming it copied and reverse-engineered its CICS mainframe service to develop a rival product, the Micro Focus Enterprise Server.
In a statement regarding the case, IBM told us: "Winsopia is the latest in a series of linked entities that have for more than a decade sought to reverse engineer proprietary IBM mainframe software for their own commercial gain. They breached a contract that IBM UK entered in good faith and then delivered IBM technology for their parent company, LzLabs, to use in a product of its own."
The tech giant claimed that the case has nothing to do with restricting competition. "The issue is the unlawful exploitation of technology that represents billions of dollars of investment, and IBM UK will vigorously protect itself against the actions of Winsopia and LzLabs," it said. ®
Get our [16]Tech Resources
[1] https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/TCC/2024/423.html
[2] https://www.lzlabs.com/mainframe-software/
[3] https://www.theregister.com/2022/03/22/ibm_lzlabs_lawsuit/
[4] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=2&c=2ZivPm0WwgjXto5kNobCTFgAAAIg&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D2%26raptor%3Dcondor%26pos%3Dtop%26test%3D0
[5] https://fingfx.thomsonreuters.com/gfx/legaldocs/lgvdwqmzkpo/IP%20IBM%20TRADESECRETS%20complaint.pdf
[6] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=4&c=44ZivPm0WwgjXto5kNobCTFgAAAIg&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D4%26raptor%3Dfalcon%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[7] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=3&c=33ZivPm0WwgjXto5kNobCTFgAAAIg&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D3%26raptor%3Deagle%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[8] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=4&c=44ZivPm0WwgjXto5kNobCTFgAAAIg&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D4%26raptor%3Dfalcon%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[9] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=3&c=33ZivPm0WwgjXto5kNobCTFgAAAIg&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D3%26raptor%3Deagle%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[10] https://www.theregister.com/2019/05/16/lzlabs_kills_swisscoms_mainframes/
[11] https://www.theregister.com/2022/11/22/ibm_sues_micro_focus_for/
[12] https://www.theregister.com/2022/03/22/ibm_lzlabs_lawsuit/
[13] https://www.theregister.com/2019/05/16/lzlabs_kills_swisscoms_mainframes/
[14] https://www.theregister.com/2017/10/02/compuware_shows_off_shiny_new_mainframe_cloud_ide_toy/
[15] https://www.theregister.com/2022/11/22/ibm_sues_micro_focus_for/
[16] https://whitepapers.theregister.com/
Isn't this... Hercules?
Or at least a derivative thereof?
IIRC, LzLabs is the commercial offshoot of the Hercules open-source mainframe emulator - which IBM has *hated* for over 20 years. Roger Bowler was certainly the driving force behind, and initial maintainer of, the Hercules codebase, and he's the guy behind LzLabs too.
And when I say "hated" I'm not exaggerating. Back around... 2000, when IBM was all 'peace, love and Linux' (remember?), IBM released a Redbook, describing in detail how to run Linux on Z series mainframes (heck it may still have been S/390 at the time). This included many references to Hercules, and an entire chapter on how to bring up mainframe Linux on the Hercules emulator - because so much of the work of those open-source hackers who ported Linux to the mainframe had been done using Hercules.
A few months later, IBM released a new version of the Redbook, without announcement, without even incrementing the version number (contrary to all practice) in which all reference to Hercules, including the entire aforementioned chapter, was systematically removed. Presumably something to do with IBM lawyers.
Apparently, shortly afterwards, IBM developed a scanning tool which would identify any attempt by an IBMer to bring up an instance of Hercules within IBM, and a 'no tea, no biscuits' interview would swiftly follow. Remember that if you ever think IBM is 'friendly' towards open-source projects...
Re: Isn't this... Hercules?
so, to further explain your comment, why were the Hercules references removed?
Re: Isn't this... Hercules?
Since IBM's take was that its mainframe secret intellectual property must have been obtained by nefarious means, neither IBM nor any IBMers should be using, endorsing, approving of, or otherwise acknowledging that Hercules was a usable mainframe emulation tool.
Re: Isn't this... Hercules?
"Back around... 2000, when IBM was all 'peace, love and Linux' (remember?), IBM released a Redbook, describing in detail how to run Linux on Z series mainframes (heck it may still have been S/390 at the time). This included many references to Hercules, and an entire chapter on how to bring up mainframe Linux on the Hercules emulator - because so much of the work of those open-source hackers who ported Linux to the mainframe had been done using Hercules."
I have a copy of the fist edition of that redbook. Chapter 8 is indeed entitled "Linux for S/390 installation under Hercules"
"...any attempt by an IBMer to bring up an instance of Hercules within IBM, and a 'no tea, no biscuits' interview would swiftly follow. Remember that if you ever think IBM is 'friendly' towards open-source projects."
I recall I had just installed Hercules on my IBM laptop in order to have my very own personal OS/390 and VM/ESA sandpits to play around in when the missive came down from on high that under no circumstances should any IBMer be caught with an instance of Hercules on their laptops... or else!, due to the fact that IBM never released some of the very proprietary gubbins that went into IBM Mainframes, therefore for Hercules to be able to completely emulate a mainframe meant that IBM's secret sauce must have been stolen and therefore its all based on an illegal misappropriation of IBM's Intellectual Property.
Re: Isn't this... Hercules?
> Remember that if you ever think IBM is 'friendly' towards open-source projects.
Um, I just have to look at RedHat...
The tech giant claimed that the case has nothing to do with restricting competition.
I believe Miss Rice-Davies had something applicable to say here. :)
Baby/36, baby/38 and Baby/400 redux
Sound like the same old IBM rumble that took place when the System/36, System/38 and AS/400 were emulated on PC platforms back in the late 80's. Back then the proprietary kit was expensive but good at doing what it did - turn key systems for industrial and business use. Then along came Netware, and suddenly these emulators could, using Netware, compete with actual S/36 or AS/400 kit by supporting multiple terminals and batch processing etc. IBM were not amused and tried to kill it. The descendent products are still available today from Infinite Corporation and can be spun up on the various main cloud platforms.
Magic
customer> How does this product work?
supplier> It just does!
customer> But how?
supplier> It's basically magic.
customer> Can you explain?
supplier> We can't share the secrets of magic
customer> Can I poke under the covers?
supplier> Do you want to die?
customer> I just want to know how it works
supplier> Curiosity killed the cat.
customer> Is that a threat?
supplier> No, just a reminder that you shouldn't worry about those things.
customer> I am not worried, I think the product could be improved, but I want better understanding of what I am buying.
supplier> Contact our customer service, they will address your concerns.
customer> I thought you are the customer service.
supplier> Yes, how can I help?
customer> How does this product work?
supplier> It just does!
customer> But how?
supplier> It's basically magic.
...