I won't be recommending that any of the people who call me to ask if they should be responding to that SMS message from Fedox, that inviting email from Amazen, that missed call from the NatWost, and what the hell are Passkeys, if they should change their App Store...

The opaque nature of scams make every deviation and distraction another pain-point for everyone. Don't trust anyone. Not ever the gatekeepers, because everyone wants their cut. And whilst my grandmother is trained to exercise extreme caution and never click that link, it just takes one well-crafted misrepresentation to hook her in...

I hope it's difficult to change the Store and not a simple rose-coloured **Welcome** click.

I don't think there's any architectural requirement that the place that checks* the integrity of software should also be the place that the platform owner creams off revenue. Though Apple does seem to have done a good job of conflating them in the minds* of its users.

*Of whatever extent they may be.

Hopefully there is someway to permanently disable the ability to install 3rd party app stores, preferably with a hardware fuse. Otherwise iOS devices have lost one of their main attractions and users have less choice than before.

The vast majority of Android users don't install third-party app stores or sideload apps. They install apps exclusively from Google Play.

I'm sure it will be the same on iPhones.

Given the infection rate of Android phones we see on our guest network when we enable the scanners it appears we have the less intelligent people around then - we don't see this with iPhones.

There's also the phishing problem where people are lured to these more dodgy places, and the phishing is getting more and more intelligent (sadly). One trick we saw was a client mailbox getting breached, the email analysed and emails sent from there with salient parts replaced with malware and token theft links. For iOS they have to somehow convince people to install MDM on their phones, even Testflight is no longer a viable vector for malware.

The one's who think they can go AC and post made up shit?

Yeah, very intelligent.

Some of us have responsibilities - maybe do some research for yourself before you declare something in conflict with your own cult BS?

"do some research for yourself"

I.e. go watch someone elses YouTube video!

Yes but the fact that is it possible is enough of a worry in itself. For example you now need to worry that your kids might install a 3rd party app store to bypass parental controls, or your elderly mother might click on a disguised advert and follow the instructions to install malware.

Which involves changing stuff in the settings app. Easy enough for us to do, but there is sufficient friction to stop a normal person from doing it.

.. for various variants of 'normal' :)

If you can bypass parental controls by installing a 3rd party app store then your operating system has bigger problems...

Also, it's quite common use said parental controls on elderly parent's phones with their consent, particularly if they have dementia.

How has access to additional app stores made it that "users have less choice than before"

Having less choice would only be the case if Apple had shuttered their own App Store in the EU, this doesn't appear to be the case...

Previously they had the choice of buying a locked down platform or an open platform. Now they can only buy an open platform.

Rrrriiiiiiiiggghhhhtttttt.

So before we had the "choice" of a locked down system, and an open system that allows you to lock it down.

Now we "only" have the option of 2 systems.that can be locked down, or open.

You will note there were 3 choices in the first statement, and 4 in the second... Yes... Somehow to you 4 is less than 3.

The option to use another store is just that, an option.

I suppose you also think that Walmart should be the only store in town, and all the others should close?

Will they "force" current users to switch to a new app store by making their offerings unavailable through the Apple App Store?

Just to be clear - I think choice is great, but not if the "choice" is forced on people.

They could do that, if they don't mind losing about 98% of their customers. Alternative app stores have been around on Android for ages, yet there's no issues at all with app availability in the Play store.

Precisely. Improve choice and out come the paranoid crazies, terrified that the impending death of iOS as a safe platform is nigh, just because there's now a bit more choice for those who explicitly seek it.

Let's get one thing straight for the paranoid: Apple absolutely will make it as difficult, convoluted and hidden as possible to install another app store (and that's fine). You'll only end up with an alternative if you clearly, explicitly and deliberately go looking for it, and I'm sure attempting to install one will result in dire warnings from iOS. The average, simple home-user will just continue to toodle along as always with the official Apple App Store and Safari. The world (and the walled garden) will not come crashing down overnight, turning iOS into a crazed, lawless free-for-all anarchy. It will be just fine.

If it helps, my parents-in-law are in their 70s/80s and are not IT/tech literate in any way. They've both used Android phones for many years now and I have had absolutely zero issues with them "accidentally" getting another app-store installed, even though the capability has been there for years for them. They just install a few apps they know/need from the Play store, and that is that.

In short: Chill out people, take a deep breath - it'll be fine. However for those of us more technically minded to fiddle, this is good news!

I'm looking at this from the perspective of having to keep people safe. Opening the door further for the innocent* is IMHO not a helpful move.

* Yes, innocent, not ignorant. Not everyone is a paranoid security specialist :)

And trusting a single corporation with all your photos, messages and historic internet use is keeping them safe is it?

Grow up.

In fact, let's take that a step further:

And trusting a single any corporation with all your photos, messages and historic internet use is keeping them safe is it?

.. aaaand we're back to Google.

Whose main source of revenue is the acquisition of personal data, with a sideline of offering services to get more of it.

I don't know how Macbooks cope without the store to protect them ;-)

All the law is saying is that they need to provide a choice to the end users. Whether the users take advantage of those newly available options is entirely up to them. What was blatantly complete bollocks was the way that Apple were adamant it was going to be really, really difficult so they weren't even going to try and do it, when in reality it wasn't and they've now rolled out these exact changes less than three weeks later.

From the Reg article [1]https://www.theregister.com/2024/02/16/apple_web_apps/ : "Addressing the complex security and privacy concerns associated with web apps using alternative browser engines would require building an entirely new integration architecture that does not currently exist in iOS and was not practical to undertake given the other demands of the DMA."

It's the gratuitous use of weasel words like these which put Apple in a bad light and make them look stupid. Do Apple seriously think they can avoid making changes to their software to comply with an EU wide regulation by saying, "We had a look at it, but the computer said no!"

[1] https://www.theregister.com/2024/02/16/apple_web_apps/

Before my life was controlled by my phone - banking, billing, health etc, I craved for 3rd party apps. Now my phone is more than just a plaything that happens to make calls, security is #1 for me.

I know malware has and will slip through the official store, but less than somewhere unsupervised. I doubt I will use any 3rd party stores.

"Before my life was controlled by my phone"

I think I can see where your problem lies.

I can see clearly now, the brain has gone? Wasn't that a song a while back?

:)

I'm not aware that anyone is forcing users to use other app stores, it's a 100% certainty that they won't be pushing alternative markets out with the update, so users will have to go and look for them.

I actually have very few apps installed on my phoned... aside from one for accessing Mastodon and a few messaging apps signal/telegram/whatsapp (the last one for family who refuse to use anything else), amazon, ebay, netflix and a couple of apps for my heating and solar/battery system.... banking apps, google wallet and the kindle app (for my own books, not bought through amazon)

I check what permissions are required before installing, don't install stuff filled with ads or that need excessive permissions, I use the duckduckgo privacy app to block tracking and so forth from other apps... I have a music app for listening to music (no streaming for me) and an app to connect to my Emby mediaserver.

It's a pretty small number of apps when I look at what others have... most have at least 6-10 times as many... and most of them aren't used but still allowed to track and harvest their data.

Without opening any UK post-EU, does this mean us in Old Blighty get a free browser choice or not?

I really want a non-gimped browser that handles PWAs on iOS, like it does on MacOS. The developers at MS for Windows 10 and 11 recognised a long time ago that nothing worthwhile would come out as Win UWP apps, so the PWA mode in Edge is excellent. I would like to come off the native iOS app addiction (/installation) and use PWAs as I do on Win 11. Also, hundreds of MB download and installed to use a one-time app seems pointless.