Cloudflare defends firing of staffer for reasons HR could not explain
- Reference: 1705300090
- News link: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2024/01/15/cloudflare_viral_firing_video/
- Source link:
The TikTok [1]video was posted last Friday by former Cloudflare staffer Brittany Pietsch, who started as a mid-market account executive in late August 2023.
On the call, Pietsch explained she started work on August 25th and was on a “three-month ramp” that ended just in time for Thanksgiving and Christmas – an infamously challenging time in which to close sales.
[2]
Pietsch insisted that she had nonetheless achieved the “highest activity” among her sales team and had “three contracts out” with sales prospects.
[3]
[4]
“I have done a really great job managing deals until the end when they decided not to close last minute,” she said, adding that her manager has offered nothing but praise and encouragement.
“I disagree I have not met performance expectations just because I have not closed anything official,” Pietsch argued, and asked for a specific reason for her dismissal.
[5]
Cloudflare’s response, delivered by staffers named “Dom” and “Rosie”, did not provide that reason.
Dom described the dismissal as a “collective calibration for Cloudflare.” Pietsch said she was aware of peers who had also been let go, suggested she may be the victim of a rightsizing process after excess hiring, and pressed for a specific reason she was fired.
“I won’t be able to add any specifics for numbers,” Dom stated in the video.
[6]
Rosie later stated, “I am happy to follow up to see if we can get that with you,” before adding “I cannot share that with you now.”
Dom later countered that “there is no situation” in which details of the metrics used to decide on the dismissal would be discussed.
[7]Cloudflare dishes up the stats on internet traffic in 2023
[8]Vanishing power feeds, UPS batteries, failover fails... Cloudflare explains that two-day outage
[9]No joke: Cloudflare takes aim at Google Fonts with ROFL
[10]Cloudflare exiles baseboard management controller from its server motherboards
Pietsch asked why Dom and Rosie – who she had never met – were making the call to fire her, and if they were aware of her manager’s feedback. No explanation was offered for the first question, and Rosie said she was unaware of feedback from Pietsch’s manager.
“I cannot speak to what your manager has communicated to you directly,” Rosie said.
Clearly upset, Pietsch questioned whether it is reasonable to terminate employment without a personal explanation.
“I hear what you are saying,” Dom said. “From a process perspective your questions are valid, but this is not the forum.”
Rosie added that nothing she could say on the call would change Cloudflare’s decision to fire Pietsch.
“You have questions we do not have the answers to,” Rosie said, before suggesting it would be “Best if I get into next steps.”
An uncomfortable pause followed, before Rosie offered a little sympathy.
“Again, I am really sorry that you are having this experience and are feeling this way,” Rosie managed.
Move product, or move along, nothing to see here
A Cloudflare spokesperson told The Register the following:
Cloudflare did not conduct layoffs and is not engaged in a reduction of force.
When making the decision to part ways with an employee, Cloudflare bases the decision on a review of an employee's ability to meet measurable performance targets.
Cloudflare regularly reviews team members' performance and let go of those who aren't right for the team. There is nothing unique about that review process or the number of people let go after performance reviews this quarter.
The Register has asked Cloudflare to explain the term “right for the team” as we feel it is not a “measurable performance target”.
Pietsch, meanwhile, has [11]taken to LinkedIn where she wrote that her KPIs were entirely activity-based, and she was “a leader on our team with those KPIs, despite me still ramping.”
She added that her manager was unaware she was being fired and “called me afterward and told me he was sick to his stomach and couldn’t believe this was happening.”
“The last few days have been a roller coaster and I have been sent more messages and DMs this week than I have probably ever in my life,” she added. “The most incredible outpouring of support has honestly restored my faith in the corporate world.”
But she added that the most common message she’s received is that she is not alone.
“Many people have experienced something shockingly similar,” she wrote. “Cold, unexplainable firing by people they’ve never met - even after years of loyalty for some … Heartbreaking stories of people’s lives suddenly changing with no explanation and just told to ‘deal with it”.”
“What??? I’ll never be able to wrap my mind around it. We as employees are expected to give two weeks’ notice and yet we don’t deserve even a sliver of respect when the roles are reversed?” ®
Bootnote: If you’ve experienced similarly horrid HR, [12]send the author a message . ®
Get our [13]Tech Resources
[1] https://www.tiktok.com/@brittanypeachhh/video/7323004085043612959
[2] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=2&c=2ZaUQV3@9QQDde10zCjwwLwAAAEc&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D2%26raptor%3Dcondor%26pos%3Dtop%26test%3D0
[3] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=4&c=44ZaUQV3@9QQDde10zCjwwLwAAAEc&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D4%26raptor%3Dfalcon%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[4] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=3&c=33ZaUQV3@9QQDde10zCjwwLwAAAEc&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D3%26raptor%3Deagle%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[5] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=4&c=44ZaUQV3@9QQDde10zCjwwLwAAAEc&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D4%26raptor%3Dfalcon%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[6] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_onprem/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=3&c=33ZaUQV3@9QQDde10zCjwwLwAAAEc&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D3%26raptor%3Deagle%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[7] https://www.theregister.com/2023/12/13/cloudflare_internet_traffic_2023/
[8] https://www.theregister.com/2023/11/07/cloudflare_datacenter_outage/
[9] https://www.theregister.com/2023/09/26/cloudflare_fnnts/
[10] https://www.theregister.com/2023/10/17/cloudflare_servers_adopt_dc_scms/
[11] https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7151621500440104960/
[12] https://www.theregister.com/Author/Email/Simon-Sharwood
[13] https://whitepapers.theregister.com/
Cold, calculated and heartless
Just wait until AI starts doing the work.
- Sackings
- Redundancies
- Death knocks
Re: Cold, calculated and heartless
Just wait until AI starts doing the work.
It doesn't need AI, just a script. Also seems normal for American companies-
“I disagree I have not met performance expectations just because I have not closed anything official,” Pietsch argued, and asked for a specific reason for her dismissal.
One of the first US companies I worked for used to hire batches of sales people every 3 months. They were given a bit of training, then told they had 3 months to close a deal. If they didn't, they were gone, if they did, they'd remain until they missed their next quarter's target. This was apparently standard practice in US sales departments, and if they could get away with making them commission only, they probably would.
I've also heard that probationary periods can be especially brutal because apparently there's even more flexibility around those. I suspect the manager knows why she was let go, or the manager should probably also be let go. But such is the wacky world of capitalism.
Re: Cold, calculated and heartless
《Dom described the dismissal as a “collective calibration for Cloudflare.” 》
"Just wait until AI starts doing the work."
I was already wondering whether Dom and Rosie were progeny of Max Headroom wired to HR's hallucinating AI/ChatGPT system.
“Collective calibration for Cloudflare” is just the sort of shite ChatGPT produces.
Human Resources
You are a plug in replaceable part. As such, the company expects you to give it your full loyalty and commitment, but offers nothing similar in return. Also, do you have any children? We have some chimneys that need sweeping.
I was very lucky that at Uni we had a lecturer who had come from Industry rather than the usual Academic route. He made very clear to all of us that, companies would do their utmost best to take advantage of our interest and motivation to short change us at every opportunity, and that we needed to make sure that we got paid correctly for the work we did. The company is never your friend - it wont give you freebies, so dont give it any...
I took that message very much to heart and it has helped me avoid getting screwed throughout my career (so far)...
This is especially true in industries where people are super interested in their field, for example the Space Industry. I worked in the Space Industry for a while, and in one case I had a manager who was super keen. He got so annoyed at me when I refused to work Weekends and extra overtime. Even reported me to upper management. I pointed out it's not in my contract that I have to work those, so I wasn't going to - I had a life to live. He did of course work those weekends and stupid long overtime hours, even though he had 3 small kids under 8. For 2 years he missed a fair bit of his kids lives by working so much. And then the project was shelved anyway (due to delays with the primary mission, that we were piggybacking on). It did eventually fly, but all that time with his young kids was lost, and it's not like he got rewarded by management for doing the overtime.
Always keep in mind that any project you're working on could be cancelled tomorrow. So never overinvest. And if you have to work Overtime, keep it for short term deadline runs, and make sure you're rewarded for it. Otherwise you're just screwing yourself...
In my interview for my current job, I asked if I was expected to be on 24x7 call out. I was told that staff only work 9-5 and that is all I was expected to work.
Six months later, my boss, who was in the interview, asked me for my mobile number so he could pass it on to someone in case of problems at the weekend. I asked about being paid for on-call and he said there was no on-call payment, we were just expected to be available. I declined his request.
He's left and I've got his job. And I'm still not on 24x7 call out.
Always keep in mind that any project you're working on could be cancelled tomorrow. So never overinvest. And if you have to work Overtime, keep it for short term deadline runs, and make sure you're rewarded for it.
If they've screwed up the project budget (cost or hours) so much that the project needs everyone to work 70 hours a week for a month, the chances of you getting paid for those crazy hours are slim.
Conversely, I heard of an engineer who pulled a 24-hour stint on a P1 problem for a very important customer. The next day, after the engineer had slept, he woke to be told that the managing director had ordered a box on not-cheap wine to be delivered to the engineer.
Can confirm this from a customer point of view also.
They have become so aggressive and don't care about anything other than revenue. It's really sad and does not make customers feel great. As soon as there is a viable alternative we are off!
Your account management team only talk to you at contract renewal time and don't follow up on anything promised!
Employee rights? What are those?
Britanny's LinkedIn says she's she's in Georgia, which is an "at-will" state. This means that employment may be terminated for any reason, at any time, with or without cause, as long as the reason is not specifically prohibited by law...disability, religion etc.
[1]Ga. Code § 34-7-1 :
"An indefinite hiring may be terminated at will by either party."
it's never a nice experience to be laid off but it looks like what happened was legal, albeit sh*tty.
[1] https://casetext.com/statute/code-of-georgia/title-34-labor-and-industrial-relations/chapter-7-master-and-servant/article-1-general-provisions/section-34-7-1-determination-of-term-of-employment-manner-of-termination-of-indefinite-hiring?resultsNav=false&tab=keyword
Re: Employee rights? What are those?
Facts that should have made it into the original article......
Re: Employee rights? What are those?
Something decent modern nations recognise in legislation and ILO treaty obligations.
Georgia - that is somewhere on the Black Sea? Right?
You could also ask them which part of "collective calibration for Cloudflare" doesn't mean (spit) "rightsizing", "layoffs" or "a reduction of force".
Or maybe that a question better put to a judge.