Loctite is expensive

Even more expensive is the damage being done to the reputation of Boeing in general and the 737 Max in particular.

Never mind how much of a hit the FAA reputation is taking

“ reputation” ????

Surprised to hear they had any left!

Please don't refer to Alaska Airlines as 'Alaska Air', just because you can't be bothered typing an extra 5 characters. It's that kind of lazy journalism that leads to airline names getting mangled, or worse, mis-associated with other airlines with similar-sounding names but which are not related at all.

That the Alaska Airlines whose website is literally "alaskaair.com"? Seems they're OK with the short version...

Alaska Airlines is fully owned by the Alaska Air Group, Inc., a holding company, with the same people at the helm of both entities.

So, "lazy" is the person not doing their research prior to posting

'Not fully tightened' meant [1]in one case ' United found that the bolts that affix the lower hinge of the plug door were not fully seated, and that the washers on the bolts could “spin ” '

Doesn't that suggest serious negligence at both assembly and inspection?

[1] https://theaircurrent.com/feed/dispatches/united-finds-loose-bolts-on-plug-doors-during-737-max-9-inspections/

It may suggest that, yes...

Maybe it suggests that "the area in question" should be the entire aircraft when conducting these inspections.

Possibly - there are, I think, 3 options:

1. They weren't tightened/installed properly at the factory and no further inspections have been done since it went into service, so a flaw in assembly.

2. They've come loose and haven't been picked up at an inspection, which would indicate poor maintenance

3. They've come loose between inspections; e.g. you're supposed to inspect these bolts every 200 flight hours and they've come loose after 100 hours, so there's a gap between "bolts becoming loose" and the next inspection. That would indicate a flaw in the maintenance schedules or design/installation of the bolts.

In any event, something will get added to the maintenance checklists but I'd be worried about any other bolts which could either be loose already or could come loose and cause another incident. The relevant authorities will no doubt be working at figuring out which of the above applies and sorting out the details.

So from what I have been able to find out.

Spirit AeroSystems used to install the plug doors and fully torque the bolts, they would then paint a line on the bolt so that you could visually see that it had not moved.

But Boeing asked them to stop torqueing the bolts as they wanted to be able to do the adjustments themselves and be able to remove the plug so they could use it as a larger entrance whilst installing the interior fittings.

" they would then paint a line on the bolt so that you could visually see that it had not moved "

A crude and inaccurate method. Here in the UK the wheel nuts of every public service vehicle and HGV are fitted with [1] bright yellow rigid rotation indicators with obvious pointers . They only cost a few pence (cents) so why not use them on critical fasteners on planes?

[1] https://www.chevronwarehouse.co.uk/wheel-nut-indicators?brandId=0&subGroupId=0

Because a bit of plastic is one more thing to fall off and get stuck in some mechanism or block some switch. Paint is simple and effective.

"Doesn't that suggest serious negligence at both assembly and inspection?"

Like they care, no matter how many people their negligence murders no one goes to jail for it. I have for years advocated for the corporate death penalty along with personal one for those in charge when they murder someone through their actions. That will get the attention of the parasite corporations and their scumbag leaders if both die for their part in it.

Loose bolts. Could this be the first time Boeing HASN'T screwed up?

When I was a student on my industrial placement a production engineer once spent a while explaining the types and uses of flat, star, crinkle and spring washers. It's one of the many things I wished I'd paid a lot more attention to when I was younger.

the correct use of a torque wrench?

I remember from my time at Kingston (Hawker Siddley) that getting the right torque settings were just as critical as using the correct washers.

Alaska Airlines were lucky that no one was seriously injured. Boeing seems to have caught the Microsoft disease and adopted minimal QC on their output.

I get the feeling that a lot more boeing airframes are going to be grounded. Then the lawyers will take over and there goes the 'C-level' execs bonus for the foreseeable future. I expect the stockholders to point the finger and heads will roll (All protected by golden parachutes naturally)

BAU for Boring then....?

> Boeing seems to have caught the Microsoft disease

Boeing caught it from McDonnell-Douglas, who they bought, and apparently the old McD beancounters are now in charge.

Various types and uses of flat, star, crinkle and spring washers. It's one of the many things I wished I'd paid a lot more attention to when I was younger. [1]Try this

[1] https://www.bolts.co.uk/what-are-the-different-types-of-washers

Boeing said[,] "We regret the impact this has had on our customers and their passengers share price." FTFY

As an aircraft manufacturer I would think that avoiding any kind of impact would be their main job.

It's shameful how Boeing's management is running the company into the ground. They know that they can do whatever they please because the company is "too big to fail" and too important to the U.S. economy. If Boeing goes bankrupt the U.S. government will bail them out, just as it did with the Big Banks.

The company makes a crap product which sees take up because there are few other vendors that make comparable products and Airbus is already booked to capacity. If the Chinese Comac C919 gets certified in the West and operates admirably for a couple of years I see Boeing going under quickly.

> It's shameful how Boeing's management is running the company into the ground.

It's shameful how Boeing's management is flying the company into the ground.

FTFY.

"We regret the impact this has had on our customers and their passengers, especially when they hit the ground".

I work for a much smaller, lower stakes, company that makes lil doodads that go in private aircraft. Think Cessnas or a North Sea rig chopper.

These little doodads are required to be fully EASA compliant - and thus CAA and FAA by harmonisation - which involves lengthy design processes detailing the exact torque value of every damn nut and bolt that assembles them as well as calibration records for the driver that torques the nuts *ahem.*

It's honestly bewildering how this can have occurred, as larger companies like Boeing are under much deeper scrutiny with the regulators practically living in there. Then again, maybe that's the issue? Either way, it makes me feel top-of-my-field that I'm Part21 compliant in a way Boeing don't seem to be actually capable of.

Purely through torqueing some damned bolts correctly.

It's honestly bewildering how this can have occurred, as larger companies like Boeing are under much deeper scrutiny with the regulators practically living in there.

Hasn't the FAA switched to self-certification for the big manufacturers because of budget cutbacks and subsequent lack of staff?

'Boeing will host an all-hands meeting today at its factory'

Well, excuse me, but IMPORTANT people don't work in or ever visit the factory, corporate HQ is elsewhere probably.

In an extraordinary turn of events, Boeing Commercial's president actually _cancelled_ an executive retreat with his VPs so that he could travel to the Renton factory to fly the flag, as it were.

The Boeing execs will probably give themselves a $100 million bonus because they did such an admirable job running the company. Not!

"Well don't shout too loudly sir, they'll all want one!"

I wonder how many other models/brands/types of aircraft have odd bolts loose here and there? Expect another me too epidemic.

I do hope Embraer, Airbus, et al. are watching this very closely and learn a lesson by proxy.

This industry has no room or compassion for loose QA or a shoddy, profits-first attitude.

As Richard Feynman famously said: “nature cannot be fooled”.

used to stand for "Bits of Engine In Neighbours Garden". Now doors?