Anyone who claims to be "all about the performance" and yet still drives an ICE car is just a liar.

Nobody who has these flash cars has it for the performance, they have it to show off - and for that they need loud noisy engines to attract attention.

All the "motorheads" I know who say they love the speed and the acceleration and the wind in their hair, etc. won't touch electric cars or bikes. Despite the fact that they are the fastest moving things around. What they mean is "they want to make a nuisance and let everyone know they drive a flash, expensive car".

And if you're driving a high-performance sportscar, "range" isn't a concern at all. You burn through that tank faster than anyone else anyway.

It's why Formula 1 is more popular than Formula E. It's why loud noisy Harleys are filling the biker-joint near me, and not their all-electric models that are far faster and more powerful. It's why boy-racers tear the tags off their tiny little engine cars and put on large noisy exhausts, lighting and stereo systems.

It's why companies why Lamborghini are potentially in trouble - their base is not built on people who feel they need to do 200mph and 0-60. It's built on people who want to be loud, brash, obvious and make a nuisance of themselves. Which electric cars don't achieve.

Don't get me wrong - I'm quite looking forward to it. Despite the danger of almost-silent, far-too-fast-accelerating cars on public roads (if there isn't already, there'll be a massive market for cutting off the acceleration and top-speed limits of these electric cars, because one will be mandated, I guarantee it), I'd rather be without the idiots grinding off into the distance as loud as possible at 3am.

Yes. Exactly this. And there will be those who object with some kind of nebulous argument about loss of freedom - just as some people objected to the end of the incandescent bulb on similarly spurious grounds (one wingnut even going so far as to suggest it would cost him more in heating bills). Damn, I’m sure there were those who objected to the building of the sewers on the grounds that they liked throwing their shit out of the window, and the flavour it gave to the water.

Still. Thumbs up. Point well made.

Spot on.

As an aside, I've a friend who recently bought a Harley. It's noisy, obviously, but I was somewhat surprised to find out that it's not quite as noisy as I imagined. Currently, from what I can hear out of my window, the top spot for being unnecessarily, ear-piercingly loud goes to small and mid-size motorbikes. Very high volume, and pitched much higher than the Harley. They aren't even very fast. I really can't see any point except enjoying being annoying.

Ah yes, the old 50cc "Chicken Chasers" zipping around until the wee hours of the morning, throttle slammed wide open. Still managing to sound like one of those rubber squeaking chicken toys on steroids.....

H-D motorbikes are not that noisy off the shelf. But H-D riders tend to obsessively and compulsively modify their bikes, some to make it noisier.

For example, the noisiest part of a H-D V-Rod I once had under my bottom was its scarily deafening honk.

Large engine means you don't need to rev it up much to move, leading to a nice deep burble going up to rumble. Smaller engines need to be revved higher, leading to those very high-pitched screeches. Either way, stock exhausts are usually fine, it's the modded ones that are painful to hear. I often hear the expression in biker circles "Loud pipes save lives", but for me that's only understandable for bikers who think they're above traffic rules and try to squeeze in to any gap thy can find, overtake wherever they please and generally drive like an isle of man TT wannabe.

Of those I know who describe themselves as "Petrolheads" and insist that an EV can't possibly scratch their itch, it does seem that absence of a manual gearbox is about the best argument they can muster. I suspect noise and nuisance are also latent pulls. Such people are, of course, ultimately as out of touch as those of us who prefer our railway locomotives to be coal and steam powered. Actually, I think my steam train enthusiasm is more rational. But I digress

[Slams carriage door and adjusts her Laura Ashley frock]

More of a "leccyhead" here and I largely do agree with you. But the experience of driving a light, nimble sportscar with manual gearbox through some bendy roads is, IMHO, unrivalled (but maybe I'm just an old dog). While any decent EV certainly is much faster, it's just not a similar amount of fun. Having said that, I've never had the chance to test drive an Evija (who has?!) and would be more than willing to change my mind; Lotus, if you're listening, I'm game!

> "Petrolheads" and insist that an EV can't possibly scratch their itch

An EV doesn't have that hot oil and burnt hydrocarbons aroma, nor the sounds and vibrations your stomach feels...

My son and friends a few years back got the full immersive experience at Armourgeddon Leicester wen they started their restoration project Chieftain tank for the first time...

However, given back in the early 90's my then local cornershop in Tokyo had a machine that puffed out the aroma of fresh baked bread, it would not surprise me if they don't do similar for EV's.

they have it to show off - and for that they need loud noisy engines to attract attention.

They are selfish gits who only care about themselves. They are deliberately getting something that they know has poor performance -- (article says 8-12 MPG) something that harms the planet. They prolly lose no sleep over [1]Sunak watering down the UK's climate pledges , why should they worry if other suffer as they are rich enough to buy their way out of most of the effects in the next few years; long term (when they are dead) - why should they care ?

People like this are hurting are kids and grandkids!

[1] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66105901

Exactly. I test drove a hybrid last year, pulled onto some dual carriageway and thought "I'd better put my foot down and get up to 50", checked the speedo, and I was already doing 50. Without the theatre of the engine revs, I was a bit out of touch judging speed and acceleration. I reckon I'd have quickly got over that, but I guess some people just won't want to.

When the Ford Escort equivalent Electric Car becomes widely available at a price tag compatible with mortals; I am fairly certain that for range reasons the motors won't be allowed to apply the full range of torque and acceleration that electric motors allow for.

Sport modes on electric cars can produce outstanding acceleration, but they are mostly novelties for a few seconds; whereas range and capacity are the functionality normal people want out of a motor.

The sport mode on my current Subaru as far as anyone can tell does absolutely nothing besides change the graphics on the dash. There are nonsense Volkswagens out there that pipe recorded engine noise into the cabin due to the lack of noise from the actual engine too. Perception over reality; and it's vey dumb.

Other examples of nonsense can be found, I'm sure.

Regarding a Lambo, "get an old one" comes to mind. Few cars will replicate the terror that the Countach's it'll-kill-you-handling and terrible visibility will induce. I'm more of a fan of the Diablo myself; the last one before Audi gobbled them up.

"It's why loud noisy Harleys are filling the biker-joint near me, and not their all-electric models that are far faster and more powerful."

I can't really speak for anyone else, but I don't ride a motorbike for acceleration or speed, I ride it because it's much nicer to be on an open road in touch with the environment* rather than enclosed in a tin can (and because I can park far easily in far more places than with a car). In any case pretty much any bike from 500cc+ can give acceleration as good as most pretty fast cars. Insane acceleration is just insane, whether on an electric vehicle or a supercar, and whether it's for a noisy showoff or to record acceleration videos for youtube. What I want from my bike is range. I'd be happy to switch to electric when they can do 300km on a single charge and get an 80% charge in 10-15 minutes.

*not literally!!!

"I'd be happy to switch to electric when they can do 300km on a single charge and get an 80% charge in 10-15 minutes."

Well both of those are already possible... but neither are really necessary for the *vast* majority of users...

300km is 185 miles, so at least 2.5 hours - which is definitely comfort break territory, and that usually takes quite a few minutes.

80% charge would be 150 miles range (still over 2 hours), and at a reasonable 3.5-4m/kWh is ~40kWh... for that to take 12 minutes is a "mere" 200kW (CCS already supports 350kW).

Even the MG4 does 450km, and 135kW charging - not quite the 12 minutes you're looking for, but also 50% more range.

An EV supercar. If there ever was a class of objects that do not need electrification, I would have definitely put Lamborghini and Ferrari in there.

They already have stupendous acceleration. High-end EVs have, apparently, similar levels of acceleration, but they absolutely lack the autonomy to take advantage of it over time. You can definitely ramp up the odometer in an EV, but you're trading that for distance at a perilous rate.

A gas-guzzling supercar isn't economic, but you can floor the gas pedal without immediately checking how many minutes you have left.

Plus, with either brand, the point is kinda the noise the engine makes. If you're telling me that those Lambos are now going to coast out of parking lot silently, well, like what's the point of having one ?

Very few people buy that kind of car to go around unnoticed.

Every time I see one the only thought I have is how ridiculous the driver looks. Could be the most beautiful woman or most handsome chap in the world - as soon as they get into a car like that they instantly look like a bellend.

In my mind, they don’t project power - they project powerlessness. If you want to see power in motion, look at a runner or a cyclist. A car just doesn’t do it for me.

And if it’s long distance transport that you want, just about any family car - even the cheapest - can do it more practically and more comfortably - and, in the right circumstances, faster too*.

* see who can transport a family of four, with all their gear for a holiday, faster - the supercar driver or the driver of a family car.

I must admit whenever I see a carbon-fibre pen1s extension I do feel slightly sorry for the poor chap. Only slightly though.

And V12s sound nice. Much better than a I4.

I also like seeing supercars out and about, they are getting used.

Seen a Ferrari at Tesco.

I quite like these supercars, they are designed to excite the senses after all. I can see myself doing one of those track experience days to try them out, but I wouldn't want to live with one full time. Even if I could afford the ongoing costs.

Confession: my brother in law and I clubbed together to buy an older Ferrari F355 back when they could be had for a reachable used price. We kept it in his garage for 2 years, used it a bit in the summer and spent £6000 keeping it on the road. At the end of the 2 years sold it for the same price we bought it for. It doesn't quite qualify as a supercar, but it was fun going along to classic car days, parking up in some town somewhere and chatting to other owners.

Now I am an EV driver (not Tesla or any performance EV) and wouldn't ever willingly go back to old fashioned cars.

>I also like seeing supercars out and about, they are getting used.

In my 20s whilst in California, a (UK) friend and I were astounded that a car rental company would rent us a Ferrari for $400 a day, needless to say that was a $400 well spent and enjoyed.

In my 20s whilst in California, a (UK) friend and I were astounded that a car rental company would rent us a Ferrari for $400 a day, needless to say that was a $400 well spent and enjoyed.

You can rent one in the UK today for £400 - £500..... but they require a £5000 deposit which you get back if the car comes back intact.

Are they cheaper there than at Waitrose?

"A gas-guzzling supercar isn't economic, but you can floor the gas pedal without immediately checking how many minutes you have left."

Clearly never driven one hard... The Veyron famously had a 12 minute tank IIRC? (obviously rather difficult to find a location where you can burn through the fuel that fast).

An EV does lose more range when used at high power... but not nearly as much as you might expect - you really lose range by braking hard (and the two tend to go hand in hand). Accelerating onto a motorway, or as part of an overtake, makes substantially less difference than you might expect.

The Ferrari hybrid. More bhp than any Prancing Pony ever.

So you can creep out of the estate at 3 a.m. on electric without waking the neighbours before switching to petrol.

But...without waking the neighbours? So what's the point of that?

Give it 5 years & it'll only be worth half what you paid for it. That's a lot to pay for a penis extension.

Low volume production Hypercars don't work like that, if it's looked after it'll probably increase in value.

Look at the McLaren F1, cost about $1m and one sold in auction in 2021 for $20.5m - of course that's an extreme example but most will appreciate.

Low volume production Hypercars don't work like that, if it's looked after it'll probably increase in value.

That's the sad thing about hype-cars, they're more investment vehicles than things to be driven. Keep the mileage under 2,000 if you want to maximise the return on your investment.

Look at the McLaren F1, cost about $1m and one sold in auction in 2021 for $20.5m - of course that's an extreme example but most will appreciate.

Or the P1. That was a hybrid with a £70k battery that was prone to failure and takes around a year to replace. But if you're not really driving the car, that's manageable I guess. There's a chap on YT who's currently converting one back from being a submarine to something that might be driveable, and parts aint cheap. But then it was a $1m car when new. Fun to see how it works, but also raises question like if it's a $1m car, why not use stainless steel bolts?

Personally I think the problem with Lambos is they scream 'influencer', which I guess makes a change from 'mid life crisis'. Think the only one that would tempt me is the off-road Lambo, but the Porsche 911 Dakar looks better. Not because I want to go rallying with it, but they stand a better chance of surviving potholes and speed bumps. This may be an business opportunity though ahead of the EV hype-car revolution! Make replacement front & rear splitters for when the inevitable happens, especially as batteries are heavy.. But that's also one of the greenwash aspects. Because of their weight, EVs produce a lot of tyre dust.

I don't think these kind of cars lose value very quickly. If anything, they gain value over time.

Yes, the last ICE Lambo is likely to get special status as a collectible, especially if they sell only a limited production run. Will be a sound investment purchase.

>the last ICE Lambo is likely to get special status as a collectible, especially if they sell only a limited production run.

The very last ICE Lambo off the production line will be a limited production run of one.

Well, that was a worthwhile reply. Thanks.