No day in court: US Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court rulings will stay a secret
- Reference: 1636128912
- News link: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2021/11/05/fisc_secrecy_ruling/
- Source link:
The FISC decides who the Feds can follow according to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act.
In a blistering dissent filed on Monday [2][PDF] , Justices Neil Gorsuch and Sonia Sotomayor asked why the court would decline to review a case with "profound implications for Americans' privacy and their rights to speak and associate freely."
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The case was brought by the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU), which had tried to use the high court to review lower court rulings on the public's First Amendment right to see federal authorities' legal justification for bulk data collection. The collection period in question stretches over the 12 years before former NSA sysadmin Edward Snowden brought the practice to light as well as two years after he did so (2001-2015). But the Supremes refused to certify the case.
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The seven other justices, as legal news site [6]Law360 pointed out, provided no explanation.
Justices Gorsuch and Sotomayor wrote:
The government does not merely argue that the lower court rulings should be left undisturbed because they are correct. The government also presses the extraordinary claim that this Court is powerless to review the lower court decisions even if they are mistaken.
On the government's view, literally no court in this country has the power to decide whether citizens possess a First Amendment right of access to the work of our national security courts.
Patrick Toomey, senior staff attorney at the ACLU's National Security Project, [7]said in a statement this week: "By turning away this case, the Supreme Court has failed to bring badly needed transparency to the surveillance court and to rulings that impact millions of Americans. Secret court decisions are corrosive in a democracy, especially when they so often hand the government the power to peer into our digital lives."
Since the [8]USA Freedom Act was passed in 2015 – as a response to the backlash from the Snowden revelations – FISC has been forced to publish statistical information annually, but the ACLU has pointed out that any review of FISC behind-closed-doors decisions is solely "conducted ... by executive branch officials, not a court."
[9]
According to FISC's latest report for [10]2020 [PDF] , it denied only 13 of 979 applications – approving over 98 per cent of surveillance applications by the Secret Service. If you include applications "partly denied/amended", this dips to over 96 per cent.
But saying that, it might not make much difference – the NSA long ago [11]admitted that it had lost track of what it was and wasn't allowed to do. The Electronic Frontier Foundation [12]also had a go at finding out , but the judge let the agency keep on going. [13]And going and going .
[14]US lawmakers get a second shot at forcing FBI agents to obtain a warrant before they leaf through web histories
[15]Remember the FBI's promise it wasn’t abusing the NSA’s data on US peeps? Well, guess what…
[16]NSA may kill off mass phone spying program Snowden exposed, says Congressional staffer
[17]Decoding America's spies: What does the NSA's cryptic memo really mean? Citizens illegally spied on again
The NSA even allegedly tried to [18]pay RSA $10m to put a backdoor into its crypto tool, although [19]RSA denied taking the money . It [20]never happened, honest guv .
It just [21]tapped a few phones , even if it's [22]not allowed to say how many . Anyway, [23]the DEA did it too . And the NSA [24]might have even stopped doing that now. Probably. Maybe.
But US readers shouldn't worry about it... After all, you shouldn't worry about things you can't control. [25]They're going to keep it up . Try to think of it as your tax dollars at work.
[26]
Many of the decisions on FISC - both legislatively and politically - have been circular, and amount to: "There's a reason why we have to keep X a secret, but it's a secret."
This week's result is less notable for the fact that the court declined to hear the case, than for two justices on either end of the political spectrum agreeing that it was out of order that secret spy courts are answerable to "no court" in America – despite the fact that broad surveillance programs are by their nature applied to the innocent, criminals, those suspected of crimes... indeed, pretty much everyone.
Too bad the rest of the justices didn't agree. ®
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[1] https://www.supremecourt.gov/docket/docketfiles/html/public/20-1499.html
[2] https://regmedia.co.uk/2021/11/05/opinion_supreme_court_fisc.pdf
[3] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_security/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=2&c=2YYlXx37sJQyVQkatGilw2AAAAFE&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D2%26raptor%3Dcondor%26pos%3Dtop%26test%3D0
[4] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_security/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=4&c=44YYlXx37sJQyVQkatGilw2AAAAFE&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D4%26raptor%3Dfalcon%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[5] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_security/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=3&c=33YYlXx37sJQyVQkatGilw2AAAAFE&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D3%26raptor%3Deagle%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[6] https://www.law360.com/articles/1436533/high-court-won-t-hear-case-over-secret-spy-court-rulings
[7] https://www.aclu.org/press-releases/supreme-court-declines-hear-first-amendment-challenge-secrecy-us-surveillance-court
[8] https://www.theregister.com/2015/06/03/humiliation_for_mich_mcconnell_after_senate_passes_usa_freedom_act/
[9] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_security/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=4&c=44YYlXx37sJQyVQkatGilw2AAAAFE&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D4%26raptor%3Dfalcon%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[10] https://www.uscourts.gov/sites/default/files/fisc_annual_report_2020.pdf
[11] https://www.theregister.com/2014/08/13/nsa_overstepped_fisc_collection_rules/
[12] https://www.theregister.com/2016/04/20/eff_sues_doj_over_fisc_foia/
[13] https://www.theregister.com/2019/06/26/nsa_spy_program_aclu/
[14] https://www.theregister.com/2020/05/26/us_fisa_spying/
[15] https://www.theregister.com/2019/10/08/fbi_spying_abuse/
[16] https://www.theregister.com/2019/03/05/nsa_spying_program/
[17] https://www.theregister.com/2019/06/26/nsa_spy_program_aclu/
[18] https://www.theregister.com/2013/12/21/nsa_paid_rsa_10_million/
[19] https://www.theregister.com/2013/12/23/rsa_nsa_response/
[20] https://www.theregister.com/2014/04/02/extended_random_nsa_rsa_bsafe/
[21] https://www.theregister.com/2020/09/03/nsa_metadata_collection/
[22] https://www.theregister.com/2013/07/19/fisa_us_surveillance_renewal/
[23] https://www.theregister.com/2015/01/17/dea_admits_that_its_also_secretly_collecting_us_telephone_metadata/
[24] https://www.theregister.com/2019/03/05/nsa_spying_program/
[25] https://www.theregister.com/2020/03/12/us_congress_spying_law/
[26] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_security/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=3&c=33YYlXx37sJQyVQkatGilw2AAAAFE&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D3%26raptor%3Deagle%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[27] https://whitepapers.theregister.com/
Tax dollars at work
Americans (and probably citizens of most countries) are paying their government to spy on them.
Re: Tax dollars at work
Yes, Tax dollars at work ... but increasing Malware attacks are making everyone try to be a lot more cautious although I wonder who has the most data, the NSA or Google?
Re: the NSA or Google
I was going to reflexively reply saying : the NSA, but then I gave it a pause and thought it over.
Now I'm not so sure any more.
Google has oodles of data, lots more hardware and tailored software than the NSA, but it is only looking for ad targetting data.
The NSA hasn't nearly Google's budget (thank $deity for that), but the NSA has backdoors (legal or not) into almost all communications providers and is looking for a lot more than a chance to sling an ad at you.
The real point, I think, is the fact that E2EE is going to put a big crimp on the NSA's data gathering, while I'm not so sure Google is going to feel such an impact.
So, in the end, I guess its a victory for Google.
Re: Tax dollars at work
They're pretty much the same: [1]The Corbett Report .
[1] https://www.corbettreport.com/just-be-evil-the-unauthorized-history-of-google/
Let me answer that one.
They spy on you A LOT. Like , all the time. All those "updates" that don't do anything at all? Spying. They watch your ip address, and they have deals with your service provider, they even directly scan your photos and images on your phone (with facial recognition). They have your whole self databased... even your finger print and retinal scan. They know who your kid is, where they go to school, and when you pick him/her up.They can even tell you which way you drive home...so ... yeah.
Re: finger print and retinal scan
I think you're reaching there. I can positively assert that I have never had a retinal scan, so "they", whoever you may think "they" are, certainly do not have that on me.
As for my fingerprints, I seriously doubt they have that anywhere either, because they've never been to my house (I do think I'd notice someone trying to lift prints off of my furniture) and my prints on a shop door won't last unsmudged more than a few minutes at best, not to mention how curious it would look to have someone dusting for prints on a shop door without any cops in the vicinity.
So let's dial down the conspiracy theories, okay ? The NSA does not employ a legion of 007s.
It's bad enough that the NSA can listen to practically any conversation in the world, no need to add biometric data.
Re: finger print and retinal scan
You have an EU passport or at least an ID card which hold your biometric data, don't you?
I'm not saying that the NSA also has your biometric data, but I wouldn't be surprised. Would you?
Re: finger print and retinal scan
I don't normally reply, but most modern phones use a fingerprint entry at this point, and many use facial recognition... so....
Re: finger print and retinal scan
You've never had a comprehensive eye exam? They photograph my retinas every time, to watch for potential disease.
In Control
QUOTE: "After all, you shouldn't worry about things you can't control"
There is quite a difference, between, let's say, choose to reverse-engineer / sell / improve a tiny microchip and not to be in control. Just saying.
Quite a lot of folks seem to to be interested to pay really well for the technology and people involved. Really, really well.
Patriotism above all.
Quote: "...broad surveillance programs are by their nature applied to the innocent, criminals, those suspected of crimes... indeed, pretty much everyone..."
*
So......I'm sure that this quote is true. And I'm also sure that the NSA (and others) have unrestricted access to networked communications. But I'm not so sure that citizens who avail themselves of PRIVATE ENCRYPTION have much to worry about! This example of IDEA encryption was encrypted BEFORE it was sent...the NSA (or GCHQ) people reading this post can let us know what the message says....if they can! I've kept it short......the quantum computers in Cheltenham shouldn't have any trouble....now should they?
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176jyqSti180Jz094YnMYNCecEU3OWrLyV1leo7di0yeWNa5u4CBhe4vbc/wO9QpMO2bLvy+eLE9
DQ5rth8Lj3dKjyfUw/Jq3yLthnLYNfAfQW5MeUJouJKOVtwaePa+s+RvPkv6NZi4LSRQZxgu05Ud
jbFNSDhUGoorMS0Wp9b3krae6erosZ6zcIIeFEZDZbC/imktFd4gcMJhP55ri1Y7DMBcBzMLhpe/
kKKmZktpBFNKGoplwznsDOyxIQ+QuYya41bbafAwjU+MkRUHRnRYQTP8rCgm0H6j3PlkfnDLAi05
0rhYfuzCG+q55rK+WLrneBt1KIwhjVZ07co3PNDgJYZVSvw84PjyA72rxcQSDsHN3bRGAfgZfVpP
SzFOZ2/f4Qb8UrvY+xxNZG8F/I3ff2JSrRPx
*
....then again............
....the same message can be rendered using a private citizen's book cipher........please enjoy where you are in Cheltenham!
*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*
....perhaps Blowfish is easier.....
....just trying to help people who work in Cheltenham.....
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Jm1e7lejmX0YSEPLW4qD9exP6y8ux06zHc6M+5DDkiykugM2VxF7jF1MNjRLedvLoNyHyj8JD41A
jFz7Qx1M6sD/JbB9Fax9zNppmw4+WbOx5Oqcdn3BTm/P/rJolJe0VW0HxW34tVGiK8pbDJJOpSQX
9UG6EL5ziWX3vFAGIsgFoJUSAtY7IqpPUKoXMl2AyXeORgzQapyrIPut+J2Tj5Cs9bo82lUHN00i
Ok/nVb51dQ0NibRhvp8apmQM55Or8MOu3ByMctuZZ0o+AjQzWZ22COJbDE4ieDsPt+6TUiXdoK29
ZjHPp2J75mXF1xt7ZkDNGIcgOhaZ5YUmdU4oNllyEZ9wFzLsXGqVui0ONsnM2rbMOQb9aQJ4QQ4Q
dCebRH1CyIiU8HMvlO8dz6SkhHf+SoDTTXFSPHLTFeVLBQ/gF7otx7xJ3/gHgVBkgu4r
*
Re: ....perhaps Blowfish is easier.....
No one cares what random characters an anonymous conspiracy nut posts on the register forum. not in Cheltenham, Fort Meade or anywhere else.
Re: ....perhaps Blowfish is easier.....
Ah, but how do we know our AC friend is really just an anonymous conspiracy nut?
If I were trying to communicate securely in the face of a nation-state adversary, I wouldn't send my messages directly to the recipient; I'd post them on a forum such as this one. And it now occurs to me that might add something to make the post appear as if it came from a harmless nutter not worth decrypting. I'd start and end with [1] a few bytes from /dev/random .
`%98N2DqZ
[1] https://github.com/Bill-Gray/prngs/blob/master/random.c
Re: ....perhaps Blowfish is easier.....
Most anonymous conspiracy nuts, cannot get even a few inches close to the insanity of reality.
accounting adjustments
QUOTE: Since the USA Freedom Act was passed in 2015 – as a response to the backlash from the Snowden revelations – FISC has been forced to publish statistical information annually, but the ACLU has pointed out that any review of FISC behind-closed-doors decisions is solely "conducted ... by executive branch officials, not a court."
Rather than worry about "what they know about you", a person might be more concerned with "what you DO NOT know about them".
In the US, the Constitution requires that "No Money shall be drawn from the Treasury, but in Consequence of Appropriations made by Law; and a regular Statement and Account of the Receipts and Expenditures of all public Money shall be published from time to time." But then, the above mentioned Executive Branch, in the "Statement of Federal Financial Accounting Standards 56", October 4, 2018, addressing federal financial reporting, with measured words, provides that: "omitting or misstating information about the item makes it probable that the judgment of a reasonable person relying on the information would have been changed or influenced by the omission or the misstatement.", even though these very same acts of fraudulent financial reporting are also criminal acts under 18 U.S. Code § 1001.
To put this intentional US government fraudulent financial reporting into context, consider that, between 1998 and 2016, DOD and HUD balance statements included $21 Trillion in Unsupported Journal Voucher Adjustments. Over the following 3 years, 2017, 2018, and 2019, Bloomberg reports an additional $94 Trillion in DOD accounting adjustments. So, roughly, $115 *Trillion* in "accounting adjustments" over two decades. For perspective, the entire US National Debt is less than $30 Trillion. And this is only the amount actually reported in their own financial statements.
The analysis of this Missing Money by "debunkers" is amusing, where they argue that there is no "missing money" but only some misleading instances of replicated accounting transactions, due to an antiquated government accounting system - I suppose, in the same way that Bank Robbery is not really a criminal activity, but is merely a mischaracterization of an "unauthorized withdrawal".
All the while, in the midst of over $100 Trillion in "fuzzy accounting", publicly, the US Congress bickers over the cost of Child Care and a national Health Care system. Follow these links to see the DOD Financial Statements and read the entertaining disclaimers by the auditors:
https://missingmoney.solari.com/missing-money-2021-update/
https://missingmoney.solari.com/dod-and-hud-missing-money-supporting-documentation/
Remind me
How is this different than the Middle Kingdom's High Court deferring to their intelligence agency?
Or any country's High Court (if they bother to have one) differing to their intelligence agency?
Everyone, east and west, north and south, is spied on all the time.
Re: Remind me
Remember this is a country founded by rebellious terrorists - it's a good idea to keep them under control
Re: Remind me
Er, I think you will find it was founded by rich men...
Re: Remind me
It is no different, except "we' are the good guys.
In reality Erich Honecker would have been thrilled to have access to the various secret police agencies the US maintains.
The one thing America is really, really good at is propaganda.
I wonder if all of the smartbombs that the Air Force has in its inventory have guidance computers that will actively disabe detonation when dropped on NSA or CIA headquarters?
From my experience, everything that can be disabled remotely, can also be enabled.
Secret court decisions are corrosive in a democracy
"incompatible with" rather than "corrosive in"?
This is not a conversation for a surveilled medium
I have strong feelings about this matter, but I'm very guarded these days in what I write electronically where I criticise the State.
When you know your neighbour has a rifle and you do not, you become increasingly conscious of doing anything to upset him.
The US government routinely hides massive cost overruns, black projects with little accountability, black ops and general feck ups behind Top Secret stamps. Their drone program has killed thousands of innocents and the few good people that have come forward to expose that were threatened with jail in a SuperMax isolation cell for the rest of their lives.
There is a often a viable need to keep things secret, but governments should not be able to classify bad decisions, poor performance and overreaches of power from the people they serve.
When governments hide behind secrets, it never ends well.