Does a Gas-Guzzler Revival Risk Dead-End Futures for US Automakers? (thedailynewsonline.com)
- Reference: 0180881422
- News link: https://tech.slashdot.org/story/26/03/02/023210/does-a-gas-guzzler-revival-risk-dead-end-futures-for-us-automakers
- Source link: https://www.thedailynewsonline.com/news/gas-guzzler-revival-risks-dead-end-future-for-us-automakers/article_7b103474-6f39-4314-9d97-2e7830a6c95d.html
[2]Alternate URL .]
> They're already falling behind on the technology, relying on a 100% U.S. tariff on Chinese EVs to keep surging rivals like BYD Co. at bay.... While the American automakers "mostly understand the challenge in front of them, they don't have full plans" to confront it [said Mark Wakefield, head of the global automotive practice at consultant AlixPartners]...
>
> "Now is a great time for the V-8 engine," said Ryan Shaughnessy, the Mustang's brand manager. "We've done extensive customer research in multiple cities, looking at a variety of powertrains, and the V-8 is always the number-one choice." It isn't just customers. U.S. automakers have long been run by "car guys:" enthusiasts who live for the bone-shaking rumble of a big engine. For them, quiet and smooth EVs — even the absurdly fast ones — can't satisfy that craving. They're convinced many American car buyers share the same enthusiasm for what Shaughnessy described as "the sound and roar of the V-8."
>
> Wall Street couldn't be happier with the new direction... Ford's fortunes are also on the rise, as it's predicting operating profits could grow by as much as 47% this year to $10 billion. Ford's stock has risen nearly 50% over the last 12 months. Under the previous environmental rules, automakers effectively had to sell zero-emission vehicles in growing numbers to offset their gas-guzzlers. When they fell short, they had to buy regulatory credits from EV companies such as Tesla Inc. or face penalties. GM spent $3.5 billion on credits from 2022 to the middle of 2025. Now, according to JPMorgan Chase & Co. analyst Ryan Brinkman, GM and Ford each have "billion dollar tailwinds"...
>
> [T]he hangover from all that new horsepower could leave US automakers lagging their Chinese rivals who already build the world's most advanced — and lowest priced — electric cars. Indeed, there is much talk in Detroit about the competitive tsunami that will be unleashed on American automakers once Chinese car companies find a way to break through trade barriers now protecting the US market. [Ford Chief Executive Officer Jim] Farley even calls it an "existential threat"... "They're going to build as many V-8 engines and big trucks as they can get out the factory doors," said Sam Fiorani, vice president of vehicle forecasting for consultant Auto Forecast Solutions. "And as the rest of the world develops modern drivetrains, newer batteries and better electric vehicles, GM and Ford in particular are going to find themselves falling even further behind."
The article notes GM "continues to develop battery-powered vehicles, and CEO Mary Barra said the automaker would begin offering a 'handful' of hybrids soon," while Ford and Stellantis "have plans to launch extended-range electric vehicles, or EREVs, a new kind of plug-in hybrid with an internal combustion engine that recharges the battery as the vehicle drives down the road." But while automakers may be investing in future EV vehicles, they're also "leaning into the lucre that comes from selling millions of fossil-fuel vehicles in a rare moment of loosened regulation."
[1] https://www.seattletimes.com/business/gas-guzzler-revival-risks-dead-end-future-for-u-s-automakers-2/
[2] https://www.thedailynewsonline.com/news/gas-guzzler-revival-risks-dead-end-future-for-us-automakers/article_7b103474-6f39-4314-9d97-2e7830a6c95d.html
Meh (Score:3)
Without a stick shift, what's the point? Put your foot down and wait for the gearing to spin up. There's always a lag.
Why bother with all that horsepower if you're relying on a computer to give you permission to do something?
Re: (Score:2)
> Without a stick shift, what's the point? Put your foot down and wait for the gearing to spin up. There's always a lag.
> Why bother with all that horsepower if you're relying on a computer to give you permission to do something?
Buy the right car and the right mods and you can have full control of all those computers.
Re: (Score:3)
Perhaps you should try racing off the green light with an EV. You'll be surprised. Even the smallest EVs (at least the ones available in north America) will out-accelerate your stick shift v-8 sports car. And recoup 90% of the energy at the next red light. There's no real lag in actuality. It's mostly an illusion from continuous, compounding acceleration. Human perception is interesting. It's obviously completely unnecessary and wasteful to need 1000 hp in a regular car, but people seem to like it (e
Re: (Score:2)
First off: you're looking at 60% energy recovery from braking, best case scenario, and about half that under typical conditions.
Second off: flat out speed is not the only criteria of a "fast car". Handling, cornering, suspension are all important. EVs can't really do those things that well.
Re: (Score:3)
One of the huge advantages of EV's is no lag, no spin up. It is why even mid range EV's can compete with ICE super cars off the line.
Re: (Score:2)
I can appreciate the 3rd pedal die-hards desperately hanging onto their 3rd pedal, but they've shown that auto transmissions are way better/quicker/more efficient than a human.
Re: (Score:2)
The continuous driver involvement shifting through gear ratios, whether with a conventional three pedal arrangement or a manumatic with paddles, is very appealing to traditionalists. Numbers are not everything. I'll happily take a slower car with gears over a faster car with (n)one.
EREVs are not new (Score:2)
The BMW i3 was released in 2014.
EREVs are only new to GM.
I had a GM Volt PHEV for 10 years. It was great. But this timeline belongs to EVs.
Gas engines are unnecessary compromises nowadays for passenger cars.
Re: EREVs are not new (Score:2)
Says the guy living in detached single family housing, presumably. For those of us trying to live into more land efficient development, there ainâ(TM)t the charging infrastructure for us. Which would be fine, if there was decent public transit.
Re: EREVs are not new (Score:2)
You got me. But i see plenty of largely unused DC fast chargers in many parking lots. These are totally adequate to charge once a week if you drive an average number of miles, such as for commutting or normal errands. Issues may only arise on long road trips on the busiest days of the year. You won't catch me doing that the day before Thanksgiving in any car again, ICE or EV. Actually I find flights to Asia rather cheap and empty during that time of the year, so that's where i usually end up.
I would love to
Re: (Score:2)
You're absolutely right - gas engines aren't necessary, and frankly they're silly.
Unless you don't have a garage on hour house, live in a house built before 1980, or live in an apartment. Then you're SOL. There's no infrastructure for you to have an EV.
And then about only half of houses have the necessary wiring for charging EVs (240V 20A or better). And, it's in their laundry room. So for half the population that rents? Out of luck without running an extension cord out your door.
EVs basically restrict a pe
Re: rumble (Score:2)
The quote is from the Mustang brand manager, keep in mind. That has a relatively small market share of even US vehicles. And infinitesimal abroad. EVs are superior. Mustang V8 are doomed.
Re: (Score:2)
Mentally they are 12 at best.
I certainly will not buy an American car (Score:2)
If American car makers won't make cheap, small, fuel-efficient cars, then I'm not interested. I'll happily buy Japanese or Korean instead.
Currently drive a great tiny little Honda Fit stick-shift and I love it... but it's a 2015 model and it won't last forever.
Re: I certainly will not buy an American car (Score:2)
Youâ(TM)ll be sad when you start shopping after it dies. Not even the Asians are importing small cars anymore.
Re: (Score:2)
It's getting harder to find small cars, but it's still possible. And since I tend to buy second-hand cars that are 3-5 years old, that will improve my chances.
Re: (Score:2)
That's primarily due to EPA safety and fuel mileage standards,.
You realize American cars have gotten markedly smaller, right?
Re: (Score:2)
I hope so. There's nothing like competition to concentrate the minds of chuckleheads and make them improve their innovation.
Re: I certainly will not buy an American car (Score:2)
I fear the same thing may happen to these automakers as iRobot. They rested ok their laurels, and got obliterated afrer they failed to improve for too long.
Re: (Score:2)
So be it, then. If they can't compete, they don't deserve to survive. Capitalism works that way, or at least it's supposed to.
Re: (Score:2)
The joke is that capitalism is being controlled by a communist country, because short term profit is more important for the USA
Re: I certainly will not buy an American car (Score:2)
Short term profit, with the added side effect of continuing to damage the climate.
Re: (Score:2)
Japanese and Korean could be next on the ban list, after Chinese.
Heavily contingent on which auto companies manage to outbid the others for a regulatory favor.
Re: (Score:2)
I don't live in the USA, so I think I'll still be able to source Japanese or Korean cars.
Re: (Score:2)
I feel like a lot of people commenting on this story have missed that a significant part of it is about American exports.
Re: (Score:2)
They're not interested in you as a customer either.
The profits from a single overpriced SUV that's really just a pickup truck with seats in the back is several times more than the little Honda fit you drive. Never mind the fact that you haven't bought a car in 11 years...
Re: I certainly will not buy an American car (Score:2)
Well, my Equinox EV compact SUV was $27.5k out the door in August before the tax credit expired. That replaced my Volt at 10 years 1 month. Would cost $35k without the tax credit, if the idiots didn't reduce production.
I mean, yeah? (Score:1)
This is the classic innovator's dilemma - the companies that rule after technological change are almost never the same ones from before. The ones from before are highly optimized for that profitable business and they don't want to throw it all away on a gamble on something new. The gambles are done by smaller companies. Even when they try to make that change they run into structural problems, e.g. the existing dealership market that had their own business models that would be disrupted by EVs. Let alone iss
A Poor Business Model (Score:2)
The number of American men with small penises who will buy these gas guzzlers isn't enough to support the automobile industry.
Re: (Score:2)
no, i think it is really huge market, seeing how most act and think, following a orange president with small ... hands... sure they want to compensate for something
Re: (Score:2)
Well it's worked out pretty well up until now if we're honest. The "big three" US automakers pretty much abandoned the affordable car market a decade ago and focus exclusively on luxury vehicles for the upper middle class. And that's served them quite well, making money hand over fist. The government EV mandate forced them to spend money on essentially affordable cars (and EVs) which has really hurt them because they can't and don't want to compete for that market in the first place.
Yes, all except Tesla are toast (Score:2)
as far as any international sales going forward.
BYD and a few similar Chinese companies are going to eat them for lunch, or force them to just relabel Chinese cars as theirs, as Volkswagen, Volvo, Nissan, Honda, Toyota, and Mazda are doing.
Picked the wrong time to stop rapidly innovating their EV technology. Oops.
Re: (Score:2)
Tesla's probably going to suffer too, because of Musk's rantings.
V-8? Really? (Score:2)
> Now is a great time for the V-8 engine
This is like watching that section of airplane disaster re-enactment videos where the pilots are confidently flying straight into a mountain. The next section is the sound of GPWS desperately screaming "Pull-Up! Pull-Up!" just before the crash.
The rest of the world is rapidly shifting to EVs, and the US automakers are building a bigger Canyonero. Now with more dead dinosaur exhaust! And we're supposed to be calmed down by the fact that they're bringing an overpriced shitty EV pickup truck in 2 years?
In
Services, Light industry and consumer products (Score:2)
Building planes and ships and fast cars always seems sexy but how many car companies are profitable for decades without subsidies, government bailouts, tariffs, special tax breaks and the ability to externalize costs like pollution? If we look at the path to becoming a high income country, heavy industry is not the path. Services, software, toys, appliances, luxury items, computers, are the path. The old communist countries were making almost as much steel, ships and planes as the west and their incomes
Re: (Score:2)
quoting from a previous comment:
"The number of American men with small penises who will buy these gas guzzlers isn't enough to support the automobile industry."
normal people want to go from A to B in a cheap and efficient way, if your intent is something else, go back one line
Re: (Score:2)
I'm not sure who these normal people are because the US market is dominated by large, expensive, luxury SUVs and they sell really, really well.
I'm sure there are people who just want to go from A to B in a cheap and efficient way, but the market doesn't believe they matter (nor does the government).
Re: (Score:1)
> I'm not sure who these normal people are because the US market is dominated by large, expensive, luxury SUVs and they sell really, really well.
> I'm sure there are people who just want to go from A to B in a cheap and efficient way, but the market doesn't believe they matter (nor does the government).
Not true. Top Selling Cars/Trucks in the USA (2025 - Full Year Estimates)
Ford F-Series (Full-Size Pickup)
Chevrolet Silverado (Full-Size Pickup)
Toyota RAV4 (Compact SUV)
Honda CR-V (Compact SUV)
Ram Pickup (Full-Size Pickup)
GMC Sierra (Full-Size Pickup)
Chevrolet Equinox (Compact SUV)
Tesla Model Y (Electric SUV)
Toyota Camry (Mid-Size Sedan)
Toyota Tacoma (Mid-Size Pickup)
[1]https://www.best-selling-cars.... [best-selling-cars.com]
[1] https://www.best-selling-cars.com/usa/2025-full-year-usa-top-10-best-selling-vehicle-models/
gas guzzlers have a murky future (Score:2)
Given the war in the middle east now, I think a lot of V8 drivers are going to be having a lot of regret shortly
Re: (Score:2)
> Given the war in the middle east now, I think a lot of V8 drivers are going to be having a lot of regret shortly
Could be good for domestic producers but I don't think it will last long.
V8? In a city? (Score:2)
A V8 in a city is strictly for racing. It's got too much power for most purposes. The one place it does have a use, trucks or vans for carrying heavy commercial/industrial loads, isn't a huge market compared to personal use. Big pickup trucks look and sound impressive, until you need to find a parking spot for them. Or deal with rough streets. Or tight residential streets. Or stop-and-go traffic. Then practicality wins out.
I look at the US auto industry today and see it repeating the strategy of the early 7
Gas guzzling V8s don't seem like a good idea (Score:2)
With a long term conflict in the Persian Gulf just started.'
Re: (Score:2)
Nah the US has plenty of oil and gas to keep the coal rolling. And the conflict in the gulf just raises prices making everyone richer, right?. What's not to like. More money for the 1%. Keep those subsidies flowing to the oil companies.
That said, I've always been uncomfortable with the various government schemes to promote/force EVs. I think I'm much more in favor of removing oil subsidies (in whatever form they actually are), and let the market move on its own. However I recognize that the "free" marke
Re: (Score:2)
the guys that get richer are in the top, everyone below will be poorer!
they are the ones that get better margins and increase their profits, for everyone else, it is just more expense in everything and causing a chain of price increases in everything that used oil...
the other guys getting richer are the EV car manufactures, that while more expensive, can get much cheaper per mile than oil cars, paying themselfs quickly
Re: (Score:2)
As opposed to depending on lithium produced in China.
Right.
I'm not saying you're wrong, but you're also not right.
EVs are not a sensible option for the majority of Americans - either due to their remote location, the regional climate and/or weather, or simply the rapid depreciation of the asset and lack of resale value. There are simply too many things you can't do with EVs that
Nevermind how bad they are for the environment vs gas powered vehicles. If we could get an energy source which wasn't so short live