Many Privileged Students at US Universities are Getting Extra Time on Tests After 'Disability' Diagnoses (msn.com)
- Reference: 0180308083
- News link: https://news.slashdot.org/story/25/12/06/0812245/many-privileged-students-at-us-universities-are-getting-extra-time-on-tests-after-disability-diagnoses
- Source link: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/accommodation-nation/ar-AA1RyFHX
Their staff writer argues these accommodations "have become another way for the most privileged students to press their advantage."
> [Over the past decade and a half] the share of students at selective universities who qualify for accommodations — often, extra time on tests — has grown at a breathtaking pace. At the University of Chicago, the number has more than tripled over the past eight years; at UC Berkeley, it has nearly quintupled over the past 15 years. The increase is driven by more young people getting diagnosed with conditions such as [2]ADHD , [3]anxiety , and [4]depression , and by universities making the process of getting accommodations easier. The change has occurred disproportionately at the most prestigious and expensive institutions. At Brown and Harvard, more than 20 percent of undergraduates are registered as disabled. At Amherst, that figure is 34 percent. Not all of those students receive accommodations, but researchers told me that most do. The schools that enroll the most academically successful students, in other words, also have the largest share of students with a disability that could prevent them from succeeding academically. "You hear 'students with disabilities' and it's not kids in wheelchairs," one professor at a selective university, who requested anonymity because he doesn't have tenure, told me. "It's just not. It's rich kids getting extra time on tests...."
>
> Recently, mental-health issues have joined ADHD as a primary driver of the accommodations boom. Over the past decade, the number of young people diagnosed with depression or anxiety has exploded. L. Scott Lissner, the ADA coordinator at Ohio State University, told me that 36 percent of the students registered with OSU's disability office have accommodations for mental-health issues, making them the largest group of students his office serves. Many receive testing accommodations, extensions on take-home assignments, or permission to miss class. Students at Carnegie Mellon University whose severe anxiety makes concentration difficult might get extra time on tests or permission to record class sessions, Catherine Samuel, the school's director of disability resources, told me. Students with social-anxiety disorder can get a note so the professor doesn't call on them without warning... Some students get approved for housing accommodations, including single rooms and emotional-support animals. Other accommodations risk putting the needs of one student over the experience of their peers. One administrator told me that a student at a public college in California had permission to bring their mother to class. This became a problem, because the mom turned out to be an enthusiastic class participant. Professors told me that the most common — and most contentious — accommodation is the granting of extra time on exams...
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> Several of the college students I spoke with for this story said they knew someone who had obtained a dubious diagnosis... The surge itself is undeniable. Soon, some schools may have more students receiving accommodations than not, a scenario that would have seemed absurd just a decade ago. Already, at one law school, 45 percent of students receive academic accommodations. Paul Graham Fisher, a Stanford professor who served as co-chair of the university's disability task force, told me, "I have had conversations with people in the Stanford administration. They've talked about at what point can we say no? What if it hits 50 or 60 percent? At what point do you just say 'We can't do this'?" This year, 38 percent of Stanford undergraduates are registered as having a disability; in the fall quarter, 24 percent of undergraduates were receiving academic or housing accommodations.
[1] https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/accommodation-nation/ar-AA1RyFHX
[2] https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2024/05/23/1252941968/adhd-diagnoses-are-rising-1-in-9-u-s-kids-have-gotten-one-new-study-finds
[3] https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/05/childhood-in-an-anxious-age/609079/?
[4] https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/23/health/mental-health-crisis-teens.html
This is how the US works unfortunately (Score:5, Interesting)
It's sad to say, but this is part and parcel for the US. The rich want to get every advantage they can, and their money allows them to. So as students with real disabilities get accommodations the rich see it as someone getting something they don't and immediately go about finding a way they can get it to. It doesn't matter that they don't deserve it, they think they deserve it simply because someone else is getting it. And with the US healthcare system, they can always find someone willing to give their kids a diagnosis whether they need it or not because they are willing to pay the price (And can afford to pay the price). This is what the US has become, a plutocracy. The rich get whatever they want because they can afford to buy everything and in the US, everything is for sale.
Re: (Score:2)
You don't even need a diagnosis. If you just go to disabled student services you can tell them you're unable to concentrate blah blah blah
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I'm willing to let this slide, *IF* the extra time, and why, is disclosed to the universities.
Re: (Score:2)
Nevermind. [1]https://news.slashdot.org/comm... [slashdot.org] makes too many valid points.
[1] https://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=23862343&cid=65841255
Game theory (Score:3, Insightful)
The inevitable consequence of making X advantageous in a competitive system is that you will see more of X and X-like for any value of X.
Re: Game theory (Score:2)
Unfortunately this is true. Mental health and dubious medical diagnoses are how white people game the system. There's not much you can do to fight it, and it's easier to go with the flow since you need to pick your battles.
Re: (Score:1)
Neat game. Unfortunately this is true. Single women having multiple babies with multiple men are how black people game the system. There's not much you can do to fight it, and it's easier to go with the flow since you need to pick your battles. Did I do ok? All systems get gamed. The difference with 'white people' is that a whole medical community is complicit in this and we could start looking there with regards to dubious medical diagnoses.
This is what classism looks like (Score:5, Insightful)
privilege knows no bounds, greed is insatiable, these upper class people will destroy this civilization just like they have so many others
Re: (Score:2)
I do have to say that nothing of value will be lost, because a society that allows people to get incredibly rich or incredibly powerful is pretty much broken. Sure, there are some people that can handle being rich or powerful without turning into assholes (or worse) respectively there are some people that turn out to be decent people when money and/or power makes them reveal their true self, but most people that want power or money are defective and assholes just by wanting that. We have a few stellar examp
Re:This is what envy looks like (Score:1)
"...a society that allows people to get incredibly rich or incredibly powerful is pretty much broken." Are you insane or just Marxist green with envy ? Every successful culture in human history has rewarded the extremely productive individual with extreme wealth. Inherited wealth is a "friction", but not intolerable. Individual financial reward is as true for the post-mod GPU-designer as it was for 18-th Century French loom-builders and iron-age Hittite silk-road merchants. Parasitic DEI
Re: (Score:2)
The insane here is you because you have trouble understanding reality. You also lack understanding and insight into human history.
Incidentally, you are also pretty dumb, because
> Just pause and consider what places without it look like.
was never stated or implied by me. That is all you making crap up.
Re: (Score:2)
No. I am disowning nothing. You are just incapable of understanding text. Obviously to anybody not utterly dumb (unlike you), one civilization will simply be replaced by another one, hence your claim of "without" is complete nonsense. "The civilization" does not exist. All we have is instances of "a civilization".
Have you met these kids? (Score:1)
Yeah, they do have anxiety issues. The school will also provide doctors for the diagnosis. Maybe my sample is small, but the schools I've seen are all that way.... And yeah, sheltered Betty/Bob are going to have a rougher time because they had helicopter parents and can't wipe their own noses. I'm not competing with them in the workforce so let them pay tuition to help fund others.
Have you met these Presidential candidates? (Score:3)
> Yeah, they do have anxiety issues. The school will also provide doctors for the diagnosis. Maybe my sample is small, but the schools I've seen are all that way.... And yeah, sheltered Betty/Bob are going to have a rougher time because they had helicopter parents and can't wipe their own noses. I'm not competing with them in the workforce so let them pay tuition to help fund others.
Not competing? Citizens campaigning to run entire countries had to compete against what society turned a blind eye to. And lost.
America ended up with a DEI administration comprised of a man suffering from dementia (an actual disability) that was normalized and dismissed while labeling critics liars, and a wholly incompetent VP suffering from sobriety and word salad mouth that was normalized with random cackles, while labeling critics sexist.
Yeah. I’d say Average Joe is gonna be competing in the Un
Re: (Score:1)
> Yeah, they do have anxiety issues.
If this is true, and not just faking it to get ahead, then future society will be drastically different from what we have today and not in a good way.
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I think anxiety is pretty common in college students.
"disabled" (Score:2)
> professors "struggle to accommodate the many students with an official disability designation,"
Do they also get to bring their "emotional support animals" to the test?
> "At Brown and Harvard, more than 20 percent of undergraduates are registered as disabled. At Amherst, that figure is 34 percent."
Why does that not surprise me.
Re: "disabled" (Score:1)
> Do they also get to bring their "emotional support animals" to the test?
Hi, Prof. Here for the test. I've brought my emotional support nerd. Nerds aren't people, so he counts. Don't mind if we wispers emotionally supporting right answers into my ear.
TFA has a bit about a kid who brought his mother to class and she ended up doing all of his class participation for him.
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>> professors "struggle to accommodate the many students with an official disability designation,"
> Do they also get to bring their "emotional support animals" to the test?
>> "At Brown and Harvard, more than 20 percent of undergraduates are registered as disabled. At Amherst, that figure is 34 percent."
> Why does that not surprise me.
If the kids are looking for the real surprise, it’s at the bottom of the box.
When “disabled” college students graduate and find out what “word” got added to the default rejection filter at LinkedIn.
Then they’ll find out the value of honesty and integrity.
Re: (Score:2)
> professors "struggle to accommodate the many students with an official disability designation,"
I wonder how they struggle to accomodate? At my university, if you get extra time, you take the test in the testing center. It is completely free to me. Actually, I'd rather ALL my student take it in the testing center. Then it give me time to work on my next module or research paper.
How you fix it. (Score:1)
Undoubtably an incredible amount of, we’ll call it “consideration and accommodation” to be kind, has been going on all throughout early and latter educational years to allow this problem to grow to stress resources at the university level.
It would appear a LOT more now have some sort of qualifying disability to enable a benefit on timed tests and education in general. A disabled statistical increase not unlike the LGBTQ+ hockey stick chart that suggests all of Gen Beta will be gay, bi, or
Re: How you fix it. (Score:1)
To fuck with gentle reminders. Bring back caning, I say.
I see something like that as well (Score:3)
There is also a very easy way around it and one that is pedagogically sound: Give students generous time in exams. I do that routinely because I think the "time" angle in skills test (and IQ tests) is nonsense in mental tests. Somebody that can understand and use a thing is vastly superior to somebody that cannot do it. Whether they can do it fast or slow does really not matter much or at all. Hence what happens with my "more time" students is that they do not get any specific advantage, most do not even take the extra time on my exams. The ones with real issues are all fine with that and I guess these are the only ones I see here.
Of course, this requires exams that actually test insight and skills, not just memorization (which is mostly worthless anyways today) or training. And these take much more time to make and much more time to correct and (gasp!) the person making the exam actually has to have a real clue about their subject! It is surprising how often that is not the case in academic teaching.
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> There is also a very easy way around it and one that is pedagogically sound: Give students generous time in exams. I do that routinely because I think the "time" angle in skills test (and IQ tests) is nonsense in mental tests. Somebody that can understand and use a thing is vastly superior to somebody that cannot do it. Whether they can do it fast or slow does really not matter much or at all. Hence what happens with my "more time" students is that they do not get any specific advantage, most do not even take the extra time on my exams. The ones with real issues are all fine with that and I guess these are the only ones I see here.
> Of course, this requires exams that actually test insight and skills, not just memorization (which is mostly worthless anyways today) or training. And these take much more time to make and much more time to correct and (gasp!) the person making the exam actually has to have a real clue about their subject! It is surprising how often that is not the case in academic teaching.
The questionable definition of “disabled” today, reflects considerable coddling that likely isn’t justified for many given the hockey-stick shaped statistical chart tracking that. That is already a handicap for them in adulthood. Perhaps we not coddle them further and assume “slow and easy” is a speed their boss won’t use to replace them. Quickly.
Reality comes fast and hard the minute you step off that graduation stage. Are we helping or hurting with more college tol
Re: (Score:2)
The whole idea of giving better conditions to people with whatever issues is deeply flawed in academic education. I am not testing to be "fair" or "inclusive" or anything like that. I am testing to make sure everybody that gets that degree has the skills and and mental abilities and some basic knowledge to go with it. Anybody that does not cut it, for any reason, must not get that degree, period.
Also note that "hard work", gets you nothing. Some get there without hard work, some get there with it, some do
Re:I see something like that as well (Score:4, Insightful)
(I teach CS in college and grad school.)
Yeah, that's essentially what I do. My typical exam time is 75 minutes because of the way my university schedule is setup. My exams usually do not require more than about 35 minutes to do. You can get a good prediction for peoples grade based on when they leave.
If they leave before 30 minutes, they are likely getting F; leaving between 30 to 45 minutes is likely A; leaving within 40 to 55 is likely B; leaving before 70 minutes is likely C, staying to the end are usually Ds and Fs.
The time angle only make sense in orders of magnitude. I am teaching database this semester. I have a few SQL questions on my exam. It should take you about a minute or two to figure out the question and answer it. If you are particularly slow/not too practiced, it might take you 4-5. But it shouldn't take 10.
I often see students saying "I could figure it out, but it would have taken me much more time". Then really it means you are not practiced enough, so I still feel the grade is fair.
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I only rarely have very early leavers with bad grades, but yes, I see the overall effect as well.
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Agree, I think that is the solution. Way back in the day when I was in school, I would categorize tests into 2. Time constrained/not time constrained. Different approach to taking each type. If you take away the time aspect, then it does seem you could remove "accommodations".
A whole bunch of questions (Score:2)
1) Why are tests timed at all? The smart people usually finish early. Is more time helpful to anyone - or just the kids having problems answering the questions. Why not double the time and let everyone spend 10 minutes obsessing over the questions they do not understand.
2) Should we encourage professors and bosses to just be more accommodating. There is no good reason to let them be assholes and put arbitrary time limits. Good bosses keep their good employees happy - shouldn't professors do the same? Gi
Re: A whole bunch of questions (Score:1)
Sorry Chief, I need a little extra time
a) putting out this house fire
b) catching the axe murderer
c) appllying CPR to the patient
d) cooking up this burger the customer paid for
e) preparing the regulatory filings ahead of the legally binding deadline
f) sitting on the couch and smoking pot instead of making myself useful
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So you hand picked the few and extremely uncommon jobs that actually had real time constraints and think you are smart?
Nope, you need to get better at arguing.
Lets go through those cases one by one:
A) Fire men spend 90% of their time training - which they get all the extra time they need. Yes, in a real emergency they need to hustle, but even then they use the slow is smooth, smooth is fast technique. They do not rush because you make mistakes when you rush.
B) Catching criminals is a slow methodical pro
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Sorry Chief, I need a little extra time
a) putting out this house fire
"nope, if the crew can't put the house fire out in 5 minutes y'all have to walk away"
real work vs an on paper test is differnt and we s (Score:2)
real work vs an on paper test is differnt and we should be testing more with real hands cases or tests that are not cram based.
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Are smart people more prone to psychological issues?
As my father (a heavy duty mechanic) told me often, "The more complicated you make something, the more likely it is to break down." I think that's true of brains. But I doubt that would account for quarter or more of the student body being "disabled".
Rather, considering how the number of self-diagnosing jackasses I've met has skyrocketed in the 2000s, I can totally see victimhood being part of the problem.
"There are no more stupid people anymore. Everybod
Re: (Score:2)
"do you really think the grades are that important?"
If I'm asking somebody's opinion of John Stuart Mills, probably not. But if I need them to design a bridge, the yes, I want to know they were graded. And, to one point expressed in the article, I want to know the institution is concerned about maintaining a reputation for producing capable graduates.
If we think a bachelors degree has low utility now, imagine what value employers place on it if grading stops being a gatekeeper. It might be slightly more fav
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That works until you do so badly you end up on academic probation and get expelled the next semester. I've seen it almost happen. Kid was very well to do and got their act together enough to get off probation. It was close. I expect some of this stuff is to allow who was it, Lori Laughlin treatment.
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I don't agree that time limits are meaningless. There are plenty of tasks you should be able to accomplish within a reasonable time limit.
Every semester I have students telling me they knew everything but could not complete it in the exam time. Yet A students were done within half of the exam time. The time limit is not meaningless.
Fundamentally, all tasks are bound in time. If I contract a painter to repaint my bedroom one color and they tell me it's gonna take 7 months, I'm getting a different crew!
Now th
Just give unlimited testing time to everyone! (Score:1)
I always struggled with timed tests. I had a lot of childhood trauma living in section 8 housing and my family being a victim of many various crimes at a very young age, so I've always had a ton of anxiety. I was that kid in the hallway still doing my advanced math test in the hallway as I needed 3 times the time to finish, but always got an A. I also was afraid of submitting any answer unless I checked it forwards, backwards, and thought of multiple ways of solving it. In my real job I'm an IT architec
Re: Just give unlimited testing time to everyone! (Score:2)
The alternative would be to allow people to take tests at their own chosen time. Some people are more effective in the morning. Some in the evening. Larks vs owls and so on.
I myself am absolutely useless before 12pm and excel at cognitive skills between 8pm and 1am.
Tailor test times to the chronotype and the anxiety about tests will drop at least in half. Guaranteed.
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(I teach CS in college and grad school.)
You can't practically give unlimited time. An unproctored test will see massive cheating on the test. So if you want the output of the test to somewhat resemble the skill of the student, you need a proctor. And that proctor needs to go home eventually.
By the constraint of my university, most of my test are 75 minutes long. The way my tests are built, you probably should not need more than 45 minutes to answer everything. Yet, I always have students staying the entire
Re: (Score:1)
> (I teach CS in college and grad school.)
> You can't practically give unlimited time. An unproctored test will see massive cheating on the test. So if you want the output of the test to somewhat resemble the skill of the student, you need a proctor. And that proctor needs to go home eventually.
> By the constraint of my university, most of my test are 75 minutes long. The way my tests are built, you probably should not need more than 45 minutes to answer everything. Yet, I always have students staying the entire time that is available.
> During exam week, we have to give a full 150 minutes. Usually A students leave within 30-50 minutes. B students tend to leave within 40-60 minutes. C students will stay about an hour and a half. And D and F student will stay the entire time staring at their exam without having written anything on it for the last hour and a half; but still they will stay another 30 minute.
> So unlimited testing time is just adding expenses and inconvenience without benefiting students at all.
For me, as an adult, I found that taking vitamin D, and magnesium threonate really helps with my memory and speed. I remember a CS teacher of mine said that for me, I was the opposite of most other students. I would be the first student to quickly grasp algorithms, and make connections and such, but I needed to improve on my code organization and syntax. One job I had a coworker that was the other way around, as he had a dual major in CS and English. We worked great together. I would come up with elega
I live in a town where every kid is special (Score:1)
Suburb of Boston. Median household income well into six figures. Houses going for a million-plus. And over a quarter of the kids in the school system have IEPs on file.
Even worse in some of the other rich towns around here.
Granted I didn't grow up in a million dollar school district, but back in my day, maybe 2 or 3 percent of the kids in my class had IEPs and you could tell they had problems.
A quarter of my graduating class did *not* have problems. And back then they did not have IEPs.
It is 110% a scam to
Think different (Score:2)
Apple said it best, there are many people who have very different ways of thinking that don't fit into traditional academic or socially typical ways of thinking. Sometimes someone with a different way of thinking can literally change the world, while the same way of thinking can get you seen as disabled and hopeless at the same time. The whole DSM and Academic grading framework needs to be thrown out and rewrite to reflect the true diversity of human thought.
In fact, I say with the fight against AGI com
Have fun with the world in the next 20-50 years. (Score:1)
It's gonna be like Idiocracy, but worse.
Kiddos reading this: Learn a trade or three. Welding. Carpentry. Electrician. Plumbing. Machining. Metalwork. Masonry, and keep on being engineers, architects and the like.
Someone's gonna have to rebuild the world after it collapses from the death of the last clueful generations. What's going to replace us looks really dubious.
Sad but accommodations are not the right answer (Score:2)
Schools need to recognize not everyone learns the same, not every one tests the same. They need to stop the insanity of expecting a "normal" way and then the accommodated way, and consider if the very way they teach and test themselves are flawed.
Opinion time, which I don't have time to explain a lot of, but I think our entire model of schooling is entirely broken.
Tests should be about demonstrating COMPETENCY not the ability to memorize something you'll subsequently forget. All tests should be open-book to
Stop coddling these children (Score:2)
Everyone has problems. Some are worse than others. Someone else is always worse off.
Get used to it.
Get over it.
Get on with it.
[1]https://x.com/BrianRoemmele/st... [x.com]
[1] https://x.com/BrianRoemmele/status/1991332887074074806
Re: (Score:1)
My problems are ALWAYS your problems ! We are referencing a very entitled generation. The rich are entitled to grift, the poor are entitled to steal, the feb entitled to teach and the down-trodden entitled to invade. It's a perverse multiplexing of Leon Trotsky, Ann Rand & John Watson.
Stress is just a part of life (Score:2)
Stress is an integral part of life. Instead of overdiagnosing and giving those people a get-out-of-jail-free card, we should try and teach them how to manage stress more effectively and how what is worth actually worrying about. Because - guess what? - the stress of life never goes away.
Larks vs Owls (Score:2)
Allow people to take tests at their preferred time of the day and the anxiety will be slashed in half.
My brain doesn't boot up before 12pm and I am best at focused work between 8pm and 1am.
I did well at school but as a night owl I always felt like I struggled with time during any test if the test was in the morning. Even though I was prepared, I could not help but feel like my brain was working in slow motion mode, like walking through water.
All because the test was outside of my productive time zone.
It's not just universities (Score:2)
This has been true and kind of just an open secret in K-12 and higher ed for many, many years now.
When you create a bunch of "free" programs, families with resources tend to be the ones who have the knowledge and means to exploit them.
For just one of many examples:
[1]https://www.law.georgetown.edu... [georgetown.edu]
Studies have shown that (government backed) scholarship dollars disproportionately go to wealthy students too.
This is frankly the core of our education system. Listen to "Nice White Parents" if you missed it a few
[1] https://www.law.georgetown.edu/poverty-journal/blog/the-idea-designed-for-all-enforced-for-few/
This is outrage bait about a (Score:2)
psychological game with very very few real consequences. Ive given college level exams to a LOT university students, and seen the numbers on how they perform. Here are a few things that I can say with certainty. With a few extremely, incredibly, truly RARE one-out-of-many-thousands-type exceptions:
1. Anyone with a truly profound learning disability didnt make it this far, through no fault of their own.
2. While the diagnoses are (usually) legit, anyone in college with a diagnosis that gives them extra
It's like "emotional support animals" (Score:2)
Don't want to pay the usual fees to have a pet in your apartment? Register your pet as an "emotional support animal." It's not so hard to do, you can always find a justification for the label.
Don't want to work? Find a doctor that will diagnose you as disabled in some way. I have a family member that was so determined to get disability payments, that he went from doctor to doctor until he found one that would fill out the necessary paperwork.
There are some legitimately disadvantaged students. But the thresh
Yes, ADHD exists. Fakes mess it up for others (Score:1)
I know someone who recently had to move to a different university because their very real and long-proven symptoms of severe anxiety, PTSD, clinical depression, and ADHD, weren't accepted by the university they were attending (a very "right wing" school). This is despite years of history with analysis and treatment by multiple mental health experts. The new university has provided proper support, and the student found a mental health therapist whose treatments have been extremely effective. This student
who cares? The customer is always right. (Score:2)
Its their education. Let them do what they want.
Bull fucking shit (Score:1, Flamebait)
And I mean that from the bottom of my heart. I knew disabled kids in college and they got absolutely no special dispensation.
In particular a kid of a friend with some pretty significant health problems repeatedly ended up in the hospital due to those problems and just had to deal with it. And my type 1 diabetic friend is extremely smart but didn't have a prayer in hell in college.
This is rage bait of the worst kind. But the old farts around here will eat it up like candy
Incentives (Score:2)
This is what happens when planning is done on the basis of perceived pain rather than incentive structures.
Real disabled people should have real accommodations. There should be non-trivial negative consequences for assholes filing spurious claims. Otherwise it's a race to the bottom, and everyone eventually has to capitulate and fake a condition. Or the most moral hold out, and become the most severely punished by the system.
Time for a critical thinking lesson (Score:1)
The article is written by one Rose Horowitch
A quick Google search turns up several of her other "articles"
Every single one of them is a poorly written and poorly researched opinion piece similar to this one talking about some moral panic regarding the collapse of the American education system with a special emphasis on how bad colleges.
This is more anti-higher education propaganda because Rich assholes do not want your kid or your grandkid getting a good education and thinking for themselves.
What accommodations? (Score:2)
I have both Asperger's and OCD (yes, I'm aware that Asperger's no longer exists as a diagnosis) and I never got any special accommodations either at school, or at the university, or at work. And this is how it should be, IMHO. If you have some disability that, say, makes you unable to do some assignment in the same time frame as others, then why should you get the same grades as them? After all, an employee that does his/her work slower than his/her colleagues is less valuable to his/her employer.
scam (Score:2)
I scam, you scam, we all scam for Iscam.
A lot of them really have issues (Score:2)
I have a kid like that, privileged, good school. He cannot spell, he will never be able to spell, he cannot see the letters. It is usual in French schools to count spelling mistakes in any test, be it French or English, or history or physics. Without the protection of special instructions, my kid would be forced to leave school.
As expected (Score:2)
If an exception is created that provides better treatment for people with vague, hard to define problems, everyone will claim to have these problems
Re: (Score:2)
If you don't want to put your name to what you say then you're not worth giving a shit about. The AC thing has run it's course. There's no point in having it anymore. All it does is allow fuckwits to unleash their most fuckwitttest version of themselves.
In some cases the world is better off with restraints, and that applies to 99.9% of shit posted by ACs. You bucked the trend this time. But one post that isn't complete and utter shit doesn't change this.
By the way your opinion isn't controversial. If anythi
Re: (Score:2)
> "If you don't want to put your name to what you say then you're not worth giving a shit about. The AC thing has run it's course. There's no point in having it anymore. All it does is allow fuckwits to unleash their most fuckwitttest version of themselves."
I don't even think it needs to be your "name". (Note, you don't use your name.... I actually do, but that was my choice). At least requiring a login so there is some "handle" to show previous activity and positions is useful. And there is still a rep
Re: (Score:2)
> (Note, you don't use your name.... I actually do, but that was my choice). At least requiring a login so there is some "handle" to show previous activity and positions is useful. And there is still a reputation to protect, even if it is not a person's actual name/identity.
In today's world, your opinion can get you fired. But yes, seeing a person's handle and history is a good thing.
It is true, if I had to use my real name, I would post differently, and definitely less. Some of my conclusions are based on research, and they are not popular with some people. But it is good to have the conversations, I'm happy to write on unpopular topics. I'm a true Cassandra.
Full disclosure - I am happy to troll some people if I think they deserve it - I ain't perfect.
So for the Anonym
Re: (Score:1)
I agree. AC used to be a good thing before post farms existed and slashdot karma was a high stakes game and the m2 system wasn't completely solved and gamified.
Now it's just for opinions so disgusting they'll rightfully keep your posts out gen-pop. In the rare event that there is some urge for debate, it's utterly pointless because the poster will never get notified they have a reply and nobody else will take up the torch for their holocaust or global warming denialism, or incel misogyny in their absence
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> I agree. AC used to be a good thing before post farms existed and slashdot karma was a high stakes game and the m2 system wasn't completely solved and gamified.
> Now it's just for opinions so disgusting they'll rightfully keep your posts out gen-pop. In the rare event that there is some urge for debate, it's utterly pointless because the poster will never get notified they have a reply and nobody else will take up the torch for their holocaust or global warming denialism, or incel misogyny in their absence because AC is pretty much only now for views that are nearly universally repugnant
AC can also be for responding to a post in a topic you have already moderated in. I always note that I'm posting AC to avoid mod point destruction.
Seriously though - unless I have mod points and read at -1, I just set the message level at 1, and hide any posts lower than that. And I mostly ignore any replies by AC's. If you want no posts on anything you disagree with, there are much, much better places for you to post from than Slashdot.
Why would you demand that those people should be silenced? Slashd
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I vote for removing the ability to post as AC. 99% of AC posts are garbage, and the other 1% would be more effective with a name behind them.
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I'm confused, the dozen posts I read leading up to this one were written in disgust and full of disparagement, calling them coddled children. Where do you pull "sheer envy" out of that?
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Keeps them moving. Envy, anger, outrage, disgust are the Internet emotions.
ADHD does not exist (Score:3, Interesting)
ADHD does not exist:
[1]https://time.com/25370/doctor-... [time.com]
[1] https://time.com/25370/doctor-adhd-does-not-exist/
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but classism does, this is exactly what happens when the the upper class has corrupted our society, greed is insatiable and destructive
Re: ADHD does not exist (Score:1)
Why not make accommodations the norm for everyone?
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Why have any rules or standards at all? Just give all students full credit in everything.
If we're going to make college the last bit of preparation standing between "children" and the real world, at some point we have to require them to do something hard .
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> Why not make accommodations the norm for everyone?
That's where we are going to end up.
Anxiety is a part of life, always has been. Somehow we have tried to make inability to cope with anxiety a weird flex.
ADHD has been expanded. In my son's grade school class 100 percent of the boys were diagnosed with ADHD - by their teachers. Doctors rubber stamped the diagnosis. I refused to allow my son to be placed on them, despite the schools threats. He turned out normal. Many had Ritalin related problems.
These poor kids needed to be taught that anxiety at time
Re: ADHD does not exist (Score:2)
There will be almost no jobs for them anyway. At least no juice worth the squeeze. Techno Feudalism is all the rage.
Re: ADHD does not exist (Score:3)
I spent a while as a professor of electrical engineering. As a student, I always hated when tests were a time trial to get as much done as you could in the time available. Yes, being prepared helps with that. But those tests evaluate calmness under pressure, speed of writing and effectiveness of test-taking strategies more than the material you learned in the course. And if there's only time to answer half the questions, then students only need to know half the material to get a decent grade after the curve
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That's a ridiculous article! Here's a much better one:
[1]https://www.nytimes.com/2025/0... [nytimes.com]
The doc with the Time opinion piece makes quantitative claims left and right without any numbers or references to studies. And he strong statements, like that ADHD medication doesn't work long term, without fully fleshing out his argument.
But I guess he's entitled to that because he has a magic touch that cures ADHD (or determines the patient doesn't have it). Talented doc.
[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/13/magazine/adhd-medication-treatment-research.html
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> That's a ridiculous article!
The article itself gets the real point across eventually, but it is very poorly written and the title is intentionally misleading to be provocative. All they are claiming is that ADHD is a collection of diagnoses, not a single ailment. It is an important point, because you can't assume everyone with ADHD has the same problems just because they have that diagnosis, but that fact should never be used to imply those ailments don't exist.
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This story is clearly labeled as an OPINION piece. This guy's opinion is not shared by the medical community. Nor is it shared by those of us parents who have a child with ADHD.
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> This story is clearly labeled as an OPINION piece. This guy's opinion is not shared by the medical community. Nor is it shared by those of us parents who have a child with ADHD.
Of course, there are children who do have actual ADHD, But your child dealing with ADHD is not the same thing as my son's teachers in grade school diagnosing every male child with ADHD. Doctors rubber stamped the diagnosis, most of the boys were placed on Ritalin. I refused - to some threats "But Mr Olsoc, your boy is big and strong, you'll be liable if anything happens. I told them I did not know size and strength was part of the ADHD diagnosis.
And I would definitely been diagnosed as ADHD myself. I sta
Re: (Score:2)
I have no doubt that some children have been misdiagnosed. But the claim of over-diagnosis is generally made by parents who are skeptical of psychiatry in general, believing it to be a bunch of mumbo jumbo. These parents are not well educated in the seriousness of the condition, and are not qualified to judge who is properly diagnosed and who is not.
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> ADHD does not exist:
This is like claiming that cancer doesn't exist. It's total sophistry.
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The matter would be much simpler if ADHD were objectively and unambiguously measurable, if it showed up on autopsies or MRIs or something.
Fuzzy definitions and subjective criteria are a big problem for mental health.
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>> ADHD does not exist:
> This is like claiming that cancer doesn't exist. It's total sophistry.
ADHD does indeed exist. So does overdiagnosis.
I had an intern at work once who was ADHD. Really intelligent, infectiously enthusiastic, and one of the most likable people ever. But he couldn't finish a project if his life depended on it. We accommodated him by getting him in at the start of projects, then letting him move on to the start of the next one. We knew it, he knew it. We all even laughed about it.
My son was diagnosed with ADHD - largely based on them trying to diminish his possible impact bas
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That was a very black and white comment. As you posted first, it was probably also very impulsive post. No worries, after denial comes anger.
Re: ADHD does not exist (Score:2)
One doctor's opinion is not a scientific fact. Aside from that, this doctor is saying ADHD is a catch all for many different problems that each deserve attention and specific treatment. However, our medical system isn't well suited for complex cases. Even relatively simple physical injuries are oftentimes poorly managed, requiring patients to regurgitate the same information over and over through a network of specialists that conclude "I can't help you" and occasionally "but, maybe this kind of specialist c
Re: ADHD does not exist (Score:2, Insightful)
I remember when Rain Man came out and no one had ever heard of autism. It was so rare that I had gone 20 years without knowing about it. Now, every other douchebag claims to be "on the spectrum" like some perverse victimhood badge of honor. If you aren't "smashing your face onto the wall and flinging feces" autistic , you aren't autistic.
Re: ADHD does not exist (Score:3, Interesting)
NYT had an article last week about how stressful it is for autistic white collar professionals to constantly mask their perceived antisocial behaviors and fake being normal in the workplace.
This was said earnestly. Apparently it is a form of psychological trauma to refrain from interrupting your boss and forcing yourself to stop what you're doing to make eye contact.
I told the wife about this, and naturally her reaction was that I must have aspergers on account of I'm blunt anddon't always prioritize the em
Re: ADHD does not exist (Score:5, Insightful)
Real autism exists and is disabling. The people are usually not capable of functioning in society, so you do not see them. Most of the people on the "spectrum" on the other hand are just part of the normal distribution of human qualities.
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If you're a straight, white person in college what are you going to do to when you're not some type cool minority? When I was in school it was veganism or Wicca, because this wasn't as shocking to your family as saying you were gay or communist. Now, it's autism, OCD and neurodivergence for the white people to feel part of some minority group.
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That is nonsense. And uninformed nonsense at that. You might as well claim that mental conditions do not exist (there are people that claim exactly that) with about as much justification or evidence, namely nothing significant.
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> That is nonsense. And uninformed nonsense at that. You might as well claim that mental conditions do not exist (there are people that claim exactly that) with about as much justification or evidence, namely nothing significant.
What is your solution to this however, a person who needs extra time or to bring mommy along because they have anxiety - how are they going to be accommodated when they graduate and look for a job?
Of course, there are mental conditions. We can argue about what they are, or are not, but these numbers tell us something is a little off. 45 percent of students at the law school cited have mental issues? That defies belief.
People who need extra time in college to take tests because. of anxiety, will not be
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> What is your solution to this however, a person who needs extra time or to bring mommy along because they have anxiety - how are they going to be accommodated when they graduate and look for a job?
There is a simple (and difficult) solution, but it destroys the illusion that having a college degree is a simple way to determine if someone will be a good employee.
If the degree is meant to show that someone has the knowledge to do the job, it isn't great because they don't teach enough on the job related skills in college.
If the degree is meant to show that someone has the critical thinking skills to do the job, it isn't great because those skills aren't focused on much in most colleges.
If the degree is
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> 45 percent of students at the law school cited have mental issues? That defies belief.
Not really. The rate of students with mental issues in psychology is apparently even higher. The thing is that a lot of criminally-minded are attracted to the study of law and hence they cheat and think that is fine. That is a whole mental issue in itself.
As to a solution, see my other posting: [1]https://slashdot.org/comments.... [slashdot.org]
Yes, that requires better teaching. But that would be a really, really good idea anyways.
[1] https://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=23862343&cid=65841089
Re: (Score:2, Troll)
And blindness doesn't exist either. Nor being deaf. These people claiming such just need to try harder, right?
Definitions [Re:ADHD does not exist] (Score:2)
> And blindness doesn't exist either. Nor being deaf. These people claiming such just need to try harder, right?
It's more as if there were a Diagnosis of Seeing Manual (DSM) that redefined the definitions to merge blindness with other vision problems into a single category, a spectrum "Visual-acuity spectrum disorder". So people who previously said "I'm blind and need accomodation" now get put in the same category with people who say "I have visual acuity spectrum disorder" because their vision is 20-40.
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those people with really really shitty vision would be dealing with a disability too if there was no real treatment for it. autism isn't something you can just take a pill for
Re: ADHD does not exist (Score:1)
"The latter need to practise."
Did you just say tests are more about social skills than whatever is being tested?
What if some of us cringe at how arbitrary social skills are and have a gut instinct that tells us playing the current in-vogue social game cuts against our freedom to be ourselves, and cannot understand how you can be any different unless you just like being a conformist?
Remember when it was socially acceptable to smoke pot (Jimi Hendrix, Cheech and Chong) then it became cringe to talk about bein
Autism does exist [Re:ADHD does not exist] (Score:3)
> And I say that that applies to autism to. Social skills is something you need to practise as child, it is not congenital. Some have more talent for this, other less. The latter need to practise. Just like with everything from math to juggle balls.
Autism most certainly does exist. The difficulty here is that in the most recent DSM, autism was redefined as a spectrum, and the "mild" end of the spectrum manifests as socially awkward. But there's no clear dividing line anymore; neurotypical behavior can shade into socially awkward behavior by infinitesimal degrees. And, worse, in the popular conversation about autism, most people talk about the mild form, previously a separate diagnosis of "Asperger's", and the profound version gets ignored.
[1]https://www. [hawaiitribune-herald.com]
[1] https://www.hawaiitribune-herald.com/2025/10/05/nation-world-news/should-the-autism-spectrum-be-split-apart/amp/
Re: (Score:2)
"Talent" is something that is congenital.