US Probes Reports Waymo Self-Driving Cars Illegally Passed School Buses 19 Times (reuters.com)
- Reference: 0180288921
- News link: https://tech.slashdot.org/story/25/12/04/2158221/us-probes-reports-waymo-self-driving-cars-illegally-passed-school-buses-19-times
- Source link: https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-probes-reports-waymo-self-driving-cars-illegally-passed-school-buses-19-times-2025-12-04/
> In a November 20 letter posted by NHTSA, the Austin Independent School District said five incidents occurred in November after Waymo said it had made software updates to resolve the issue and asked the company to halt operations around schools during pick-up and drop-off times until it could ensure the vehicles would not violate the law. "We cannot allow Waymo to continue endangering our students while it attempts to implement a fix," a lawyer for the school district wrote, citing one incident involving a Waymo that was "recorded driving past a stopped school bus only moments after a student crossed in front of the vehicle, and while the student was still in the road."
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> The letter prompted NHTSA to ask Waymo on November 24 if it would comply with the request to cease self-driving operations during student pick-up and drop-off times, adding: "Was an appropriate software fix implemented or developed to mitigate this concern? And if so, does Waymo plan to file a recall for the fix?" The school district told Reuters on Thursday that Waymo refuses to halt operations around schools and said another incident involving a self-driving car and an actively loading school bus occurred on December 1, which "indicates that those programming changes did not resolve the issue or our concerns."
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> In a statement, Waymo did not answer why it had refused to halt operations around Austin schools or answer if it would issue a recall. "We're deeply invested in safe interaction with school buses. We swiftly implemented software updates to address this and will continue to rapidly improve," Waymo said. NHTSA said in a letter to Waymo on Wednesday that it was demanding answers to a series of questions by January 20 about incidents involving school buses and details of software updates to address safety concerns.
[1] https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-probes-reports-waymo-self-driving-cars-illegally-passed-school-buses-19-times-2025-12-04/
[2] https://slashdot.org/~BrendaEM
It doesn't need to be perfect, just better (Score:2)
Human drivers are impaired, impatient or distracted. Self-driving doesn't suffer any of this. And it is [1]getting better with every new version [x.com].
[1] https://x.com/SawyerMerritt/status/1994924224281284737
fines (Score:2)
A human would be subject to fines for this. But if you are a giant corporation with no person in your vehicle well you get a pass to make it better, as many times as it takes. Fuck that, the robot owner is liable and needs to pay fines just like humans do (and also improve the robot). Carrots and sticks.
Re: (Score:3)
They did pay the fines. [1]https://insideevs.com/news/754... [insideevs.com]
By the way, humans in SF and other major cities pay lots of parking tickets all the time, it's a money-making scam of every city.
[1] https://insideevs.com/news/754841/waymo-traffic-violations-fines-2024/
Re: (Score:2)
Failure to yield for a school bus is a moving violation that will put points on your license. In my state 3 moving violations in 18 months will get your license suspended. This is much more serious than a parking ticket and is not a money making scheme. It's a don't flatten school children scheme.
Re: fines (Score:2)
Obviously, I was talking about parking fines. In fact I said parking fines.
Re: fines (Score:2)
Obviously, I was talking about parking fines. In fact I said parking fines..
self driving lawyers (Score:2)
You can't have a product or service without some lawyer having to make money off it too.
Re: (Score:2)
At least lawyers aren't just "picking on" self-driving cars, they sue plenty of human drivers too.
Suspend their operating license (Score:1)
If I drove through a school bus unloading zone like that 21 times my drivers license would be suspended, probably for a very long time.
Why isn't Waymo's license suspended for the same period mine would be?
Actually, after 21 infractions it would probably be permanently cancelled.
Re: (Score:2)
The right people got greased with cash so the laws are squishy. No one will care until these companies kill someone wealthy or those in power care about. Until then the risks to the public at large are acceptable.
Obligatory thought bubble (Score:2)
> Texas officials reported 19 instances of its self-driving cars illegally passing stopped school buses,
Oh, its Waymo times than that!
Meanwhile (Score:1, Troll)
Human-driven cars passed school busses 40,000 times in the same time period.
Re:Meanwhile (Score:5, Insightful)
I guess neither humans or bots are trained well on that. It's pretty stupid anyway. The kids should cross the street at normal crossings like everyone else, not just anywhere a huge yellow beast stops and flips out a sign.
Re: (Score:3)
Some times there aren't any marked crossings for half a mile. Perhaps this could be seen as a school-bus routing problem, but saying "use the crossing" is only reasonable sometimes.
Re: (Score:3)
There's the really amazing big brained thing we've figured out in rural areas: only drop kids off on the side of the road the live on.
Re: (Score:2)
That's the "routing problem" I mentioned.
Re: (Score:3)
It turns out that if kids figure out they're being made to ride an extra half hour on the bus while it winds around its route and back the other way just so they don't have to cross the street, they'll start fibbing about the side they live on, or just getting off. And the driver won't always stop them.
STOP, WAIT, PAUSE, or what? (Score:3)
I have read of people given tickets for passing stopped school buses with their red STOP signs swung out, who got the ticket dismissed by pointing out that normal STOP signs mean PAUSE then continue. I have no idea if the original stories were true or if that still works. STOP signs really mean wait until the intersection clears, and arguably the temporary intersection created by the school bus doesn't clear until the kiddies are across the street.
Re: (Score:3)
School buses are supposed to flash a yellow set of lights before the red lights come on. I worked with someone who received a big fat ticket about passing a school bus. He showed on his dashcam that the bus was stopped, no lights, but as soon as he went past, the lights came on.
Ticket dismissed. However, it took him a ton of time from work to deal with that.
Re: (Score:2)
I got a bogus red light ticket once, and that was what convinced me to get a dashcam. That judge just took the cops' word for everything, so even a dashcam might not have helped, but it couldn't have hurt.
Re: (Score:2)
Maybe. But the law says otherwise, and thus far, every time we've caved to "I shouldn't have to obey the law because it messes with my profits," things have tended to get worse.
Re: (Score:2)
> This is how we got Uber and Lyft, and they may not be perfect but they're better than what we had before (crappy taxis if you're lucky, nothing in many places)
Re: (Score:3)
> The kids should cross the street at normal crossings like everyone else, not just anywhere a huge yellow beast stops and flips out a sign.
I'd say the safest place to cross would be in front of a huge, impossible to miss bus, with a flipped-out sign reading "STOP" and with flashing lights.
Re: (Score:2)
The problem is that it's not intuitive that there's a special case traffic rule for that and I don't remember it ever being brought up in driver's ed or the written part of the test. How is someone who didn't ride a bus to school as a kid supposed to know to stop for them?
Re: (Score:2)
The difference is a human gets ticketed when they do that shit. Self-driving cars are explicitly excluded from traffic enforcement and police are told not to pull them over
Re: (Score:2)
Now look at the ratio of human driven cars vs. Waymo cars.