'How Delivery Is Destroying American Restaurants' (msn.com)
- Reference: 0179898540
- News link: https://slashdot.org/story/25/10/28/192256/how-delivery-is-destroying-american-restaurants
- Source link: https://www.msn.com/en-us/food-and-drink/recipes/the-innovation-that-s-killing-restaurant-culture/ar-AA1PhT7V
Shannon Orr runs an eight-restaurant group on the West Coast. One of her restaurants generated $1.7 million in delivery sales last year. Of that, $400,000 went to delivery companies. The restaurant, previously among her most profitable, made no money in 2024, she told the Atlantic.
About a third of full-service restaurants have modified their physical spaces to accommodate the delivery boom, installing dedicated entrances, bike parking, and banks of lockers.
[1] https://www.msn.com/en-us/food-and-drink/recipes/the-innovation-that-s-killing-restaurant-culture/ar-AA1PhT7V
I have questions. Also, I prefer in person life. (Score:5, Interesting)
The question is, how much of this business wouldn't exist at all without delivery apps.
This being said, as an unmarried guy, I always sit down and eat "in person" even if I'm alone. I enjoy the people watching aspect and don't feel stigma sitting down by myself. If I'm going to eat at home on the couch, may as well just cook. Eating around other people is part of the experience. COVID is over societally speaking.
But yeah, that's what I prefer about the EU and Poland. People are much more conservative in their habits. They got through lockdown and returned to old ways; didn't stop living in person and move things online or to their homes.
Re: I have questions. Also, I prefer in person li (Score:2)
You are saying there were fewer restaurants before apps?
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To an extent, yes ... you had a lot more businesses that aren't common today occupying storefronts that are now restaurants. Small clothing stores (RIP due to Amazon), books, video rental (RIP), appliance/clothing/shoe repair places, hardware stores, movie theaters, etc. Online commerce is hugely corrosive to small in person businesses.
How does that make sense? (Score:2)
With 1.7 million in revenue, and 400k going to delivery, that 400k is added on top as a fee when you order, isn't it? (I've never actually used doordash or anything.) So you would have charged the customer less if they ate there, and you'd have to provide a table for them to eat at. I don't understand how it can be less profitable, unless you're offering free delivery or something.
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Yes, the apps add delivery fees. They also screw over the restaurants by raising fees per order as business increases, vs doing the economy of scale thing ;(
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No the delivery firms are both adding a fee on top of your order and as here charge the restaurant 400k, aka they skim at both ends. And it is less profitable because as as restaurant they still have to pay for those tables even though they are empty so the delivery economy drives restaurants to be delivery only and thus it reduces the amount of restaurants where you can sit and eat.
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The delivery services charge fees to the customers AND to the restaurants. Additionally they also screw over their own drivers so that they are basically working for tips (which are on top of all the fees). It's a predatory business model and I refuse to participate in it.
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Yeah, I can pickup my own pizza, thank you very much.
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> It's a predatory business model and I refuse to participate in it.
While that is a very good reason to not use such a service, it's not my main reason. My main reason is that such services are, by all accounts, a crap shoot on quality (will the driver eat half your food on the way, or just flake out, or deliver it to the wrong address, etc.), and because the service simply isn't anything I want.
But lacking those reasons, yeah, not contributing to the predatory business model would be a good one, too.
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Others have noted that the fee to the customer and the fee to the restaurant are separate. However, what I don't see mentioned is that many/most restaurants raise the price of the food on the delivery apps. As far as I understand it, the pricing on the apps is controlled by the restaurant. An easy to look up example is McDonald's. Their food is about 15-20% more in app. I wouldn't be surprised if they negotiated lower fees, but even if they didn't the customer is still paying around half of that 30%.
This m
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> With 1.7 million in revenue, and 400k going to delivery, that 400k is added on top as a fee when you order, isn't it? (I've never actually used doordash or anything.) So you would have charged the customer less if they ate there, and you'd have to provide a table for them to eat at. I don't understand how it can be less profitable, unless you're offering free delivery or something.
I think that overall attendance at restraints is down, probably as a collapse of dating. [1]https://www.nytimes.com/2025/0... [nytimes.com]. [2]https://intellectualtakeout.or... [intellectualtakeout.org].
And in true 2025 fashion, she laments men dropping out of the restaurant scene, but manages to get a little shaming in. Yeah, that'll bring them back.
[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/06/20/style/modern-love-men-where-have-you-gone-please-come-back.html
[2] https://intellectualtakeout.org/2025/07/where-all-the-men-have-gone-and-how-to-bring-all-the-men-back/
I can't believe... (Score:4, Insightful)
I can't believe so many people lack fiscal sense. If you're ordering through a service like Door Dash with any regularity you're paying a small fortune in all the markups and extra charges they do.
Re: (Score:2, Interesting)
Cheaper to sit down, pay cash, tip in cash (so staff can pocket the tip, helps the waitstaff).
Re:I can't believe... (Score:4, Interesting)
Yes, if you add up what people are spending on doordash, you have to roll your eyes when they complain that they can't afford rent. You save *so* much money by cooking for yourself! And it's generally healthier. Bonus points if you invite someone over to join you.
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You also save if you pick up the food yourself. I've seen people DoorDash food from the place across the street. Many places let you order food for pickup online so you don't even have to order and wait for it.
Yes, cooking yourself is the cheapest option. But if you go out, bringing it back yourself is cheaper than DoorDash. And if DoorDash is cheaper than bringing it back yourself, you likely make enough money that rent isn't an issue.
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You would save even more if you don't eat at restaurants at all.
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Or (OMG!) call in and speak to a human to order ... many restaurants still have a phone number.
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The last two or three that I tried redirected me to their ordering site.
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I saved $50 a week after quitting Door Dash! Too bad rent is $2000...
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People laugh at this sort of thing, but $50 a week for 30 years is $78,000. If you got an 8% return on that money (and over the last 30 years you would have had to work pretty hard not to get that) you would end up with $325,593, with $247,593 of investment returns. Not to mention the fact that if you are having trouble making rent you probably should steer away from spending 10% of your rent bill having food delivered to your house.
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> I saved $50 a week after quitting Door Dash! Too bad rent is $2000...
$50/week is $200/month. That's 10% of your rent, which is a significant amount of money...
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You are paying the extra fees to save your time (going to the restaurant, waiting to be seated, waiting until your order is ready and going back home) and your transportation expenses.
Nope Nope Nope (Score:2)
There is no way I would ever let some random dude or dudette with a car deliver a meal to me that was not directly employed by the restaurant.
Delivery services vs delivery (Score:1)
> Delivery companies charge restaurants commissions between 5 and 30%, along with fees for payment processing, advertising, and search placement.
To any restaurants that hate the above facts, I'll give you a free protip, we hate those services too.
They have an exceptionally low quality of service, a very low bar that would take a significant amount of time and effort to suck worse than they do.
If you hire your own delivery people and employ them directly, your reputation won't be at the whim of a company that doesn't give a crap.
Delivery problems will still happen, but you have complete control over the situation.
You have every opportunity to make it
And what does it tell you? (Score:4, Insightful)
Perhaps that going out, making an effort, just to be in company of other, noisy people, posing with their food for instagram is not really worth it? Perhaps that nothing beats your own sofa, with your own, perfect, comfy butt print?
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I'd rather be around other people ... being alone on the sofa seems lonely.
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Variety is the spice of life. During the pandemic, never going out got on almost everyone's nerves.
Re: And what does it tell you? (Score:2)
No, it got on the nerves of extroverts, who are overly vocal on social media platforms already.
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I'm a shy extrovert (I need human interaction to not put me hand through a wall, but I'm timid about putting myself out there). That's why I love a rhythm of life (in person everything) where I have to talk to strangers organically. Lockdown broke me heart - I was actualy WFH before lockdown, and I took an in person job (census taker) part time just to have enough interaction with other humans to stay sane.
Humans beings are social. You're clearly not (Score:1)
> Perhaps that going out, making an effort, just to be in company of other, noisy people, posing with their food for instagram is not really worth it? Perhaps that nothing beats your own sofa, with your own, perfect, comfy butt print?
Human beings are social and like being around other human beings. You don't?...kewl...but that's a you thing...and a small cohort of like-minded, likely autistic individuals...even I have Asperger's and like eating out more than eating at home....because I know how fucking lonely it is to sit in front of a TV or on a device and eat out of a carton. It's like any other thing...some like sports, many don't....some like spicy food, many don't....some like mint chocolate chip ice cream, I find it torturous.
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This quote would seem to contradict your position: "Nearly three out of every four restaurant orders are no longer eaten in a restaurant, according to the National Restaurant Association."
Is that because people can't eat at restaurants? Or just that so many prefer to eat in the comfort of their own homes?
We see similar data when you ask people about working from home vs working in an office - the majority want at least a hybrid arrangement and a large percentage want to work exclusively from home. And what
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Or maybe the United Stinks has become a fearful, stratified society where people are afraid to interact with strangers outside of their existing social/family bubble. I think COVID made it worse, since the authorities actually encouraged social siloing, and some people developed a long-term case of Stockholm Syndrome, looking back on quarantine life with fondness. Go to Europe and there's delivery, but much less common. Most people either sit down in person or cook and eat at home. Full-time WFH rates a
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> Europe still hasn't forgotten the art of interacting with people outside one's own bubble, and it's glorious.
I wonder if the lack of that in America is a cause, or an effect, of the political divide and the simmering hatred at its score. Possibly it's both cause and effect.
I think inflation plays a bigger role (Score:2)
> This quote would seem to contradict your position: "Nearly three out of every four restaurant orders are no longer eaten in a restaurant, according to the National Restaurant Association."
> Is that because people can't eat at restaurants? Or just that so many prefer to eat in the comfort of their own homes?
> We see similar data when you ask people about working from home vs working in an office - the majority want at least a hybrid arrangement and a large percentage want to work exclusively from home. And what streaming services have done to movie theaters.
> It turns out a lot of people would rather be at home - though they're not necessarily at home. My wife and I get take-out (we don't use delivery services) about once a week, sometimes twice. We have two small kids and it's not convenient to drag them to a restaurant.
> Whether the trend is positive or not is a worthwhile question, but it seems clear that it's not a "small cohort" of "autistic individuals" that don't like to spend time in the company of strangers.
In the last decade, the cost of eating out has roughly doubled in my area. A 2x increase changes something from a nice thing to do on a Friday night to something you save for special occasions for many. It's quite possible I am wrong, but I think the factors are more economic than similar trends of people preferring to watch movies at home.
I am in the same boat as you. I have 2 kids now. The 2x increase has become an 8x increase. A stop at the McDonald's drive through on the way back from a trip h
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> We have two small kids and it's not convenient to drag them to a restaurant.
I get that, and I hope that you do it occasionally anyway. As far as I'm concerned it's good for the kids - I feel that I learned a lot and was better socialized as a result of eating out with my parents.
I think it's also worthwhile to make it an occasion - these days it's easy for kids to not experience the feeling of special events often enough. Dressing up a bit, and being on best behaviour, keeps kids mindful of a version of the 'social contract' that could use a little more promoting in this day and ag
Re: Humans beings are social. You're clearly not (Score:3)
I meant that there are better social experiences than eating out in a crowded place.
It's kind of a staple of socialization & datin (Score:2)
> I meant that there are better social experiences than eating out in a crowded place.
I suppose that's technically true, but it is a staple of socialization. It's kind of the default for:
1. first dates
2. guests from out of town
3. date nights
4. experiencing new or other culture's cuisine
5. informal work celebrations
Yeah...I suppose I'd prefer a first-date come over to my place (were I single), but....they usually aren't into that. :). And yeah, I suppose my non-dinner dates with my wife have been a little more fun...but if you told me "We got you a babysitter...plan a date for your
Of course (Score:5, Interesting)
Who doesn't like paying up to three times the cost of the food to have it delivered lukewarm?
And people wonder why they're always broke.
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It's mostly done by the upper middle class and only special occasions for the rest. And maybe that Cat Lady that bothers JD Vance for existing.
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When I used to be in an apartment my upstairs neighbor had food delivered every Friday and at least one other time each week. I can guarantee they were not upper middle class.
My current neighbor across the street has food delivered, as far as I can tell, once a week as well. Not sure if they have it delivered while I'm at work so it's always possible they have it delivered more than that one time. Again, they are not upper middle class and there are no special occasions going on\ that I am aware of.
There
Not for me (Score:2)
I never use DoorDash, or any other food delivery service. By the time you add on the tip and all of the fees, you're adding at least 50% to the total cost of the food. I can't justify that much added cost. Not to mention that it often arrives cold, because the drivers will pick up multiple orders and then drop them all off. So much easier, faster, better, and cheaper for me to drive the couple of miles to get it myself or eat in restaurant
The one exception I'll make to that is for pizza places with their
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Yeah even picking up carryout and taking it straight home loses some of the appeal, can't imagine paying more for further degradation of the food.
If delivery is destroying your business (Score:4, Informative)
Then don't deliver.
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The companies like door dash etc do not care if you do not deliver. They list you anyway, pay full price for the food, slap a 35% fee on top and sell your food.
The the customer who gets cold food calls you upset. You have to explain that we do not deliver and they do not care.
They leave a bad review. You post explaining the situation. Takes a month to deal with.
Meanwhile you sue Door Dash, they take you down, then Uber eats signs you up. and whole thing stars all over again.
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> The companies like door dash etc do not care if you do not deliver. They list you anyway, pay full price for the food, slap a 35% fee on top and sell your food.
Then something doesn't add up. My understanding is that the fees that the delivery company charges the restaurant are what is hurting the restaurants. But if your restaurant doesn't have a contract with the delivery company (i.e. "they list you anyway") then that fee is $0, isn't it?
So what's the harm? It sounds like any fees the restaurants are payi
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Restaurants are hard businesses to run. Bad reviews kill your business quickly.
I do not ever use door dash. But I do use Yelp. I used to love a place called Bobby Van's Steak house. But when I saw reviews under 4 stars, I picked a new steak house.
As for the $0 fee - that only happens if you refuse to use their service. You can sign up for a massive fee and they offer things like advertising and better delivery.
It's not one thing, it's both combined. Either you give away your profit or you get bad revi
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A few years ago, GrubHub ran the following scam ... they'd create a number that forwarded to the restaurant, then list that number on Google as the phone for that restaurant (and on their own site along with a menu). So calls to the restaurant got routed through their own number, and they'd charge the restaurant about $6 per call. If the restaurant didn't pay, they'd say "nice number we made you, shame if it were to be disconnected." They eventually got slapped down in court, but not before they screwed
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> They list you anyway, pay full price for the food, slap a 35% fee on top and sell your food.
How? If you don't offer delivery, then everything Door Dash has to deal with comes out of the kitchen on dishes once the Door Dash "customer" has been seated. No delivery, no take away containers. Sorry.
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SImple answers to others problems are often stupid answers. If half of customers now order delivery then the most likely scenario is that you will get about half as many sit-down customers as you used to (potentially a bit more if you have local loyal customers who will choose to have a sit down meal at your restaurant even though they'd prefer delivery). Most restaurants can't survive a large sustained fall in customer numbers so feel they have to offer delivery to capture a share of that market.
Use DoorDash if you HATE the restaurant (Score:2, Interesting)
DoorDash, or any other delivery service, is garbage. They mistreat their employees and screw over businesses. If you like your local restaurant, pay in cash and pick up in person. For me, obesity runs in my family and my wife's, so restaurant food is a rare treat, but when we order, here's the best workflow, IMHO: Go online to see the menu. Call the place to place the order (unless they explicitly prefer you use the app). Pick it up yourself. Pay in cash.
Here's the problem, everywhere around me, res
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> Don't be so autistic...
That's the most recursive thing I've ever heard.
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> not everything needs to be ordered through an app. You can pick up the phone
Youngbie: What's a phone? Talking? Pffft
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> DoorDash, or any other delivery service, is garbage. They mistreat their employees and screw over businesses...
How is that different than any business? Capitalism is an ugly game, we just more or less accept that to get cheap shit quick.
So why pay more to get it slow and stale? (Score:2)
>> DoorDash, or any other delivery service, is garbage. They mistreat their employees and screw over businesses...
> How is that different than any business? Capitalism is an ugly game, we just more or less accept that to get cheap shit quick.
I think you're making my point. You're not getting food for cheap. You're paying a lot for a shitty service to ruin the experience at huge profit to San Francisco execs. Sometimes door dash makes sense, but it never does for me. If I am going to pay for someone else's cooking, I'd rather make a quick trip, save some money, and get the food on time when it's fresh and tastes good. If I wanted to make food that tastes shitty, I can do so without the middleman.
Speakers on cell phones have ruined everything (Score:2)
One major reason I don't dine out as much as I used to: suddenly it seems it has become socially acceptable for people to be using their phone with the sound volume on all the time, usually on MAX volume. Sometimes they're scrolling social media and I'm just hearing one annoying song or person talking after another. Sometimes it's someone having a video chat with someone else. Sometimes it's parents with an iPad set up with their kid watching a movie. NEVER do I see anyone using headphones anymore. Jus
Oh for fucks sake (Score:1)
We will do anything except acknowledge the ongoing dismantling of capitalism.
People are dating less because they can't afford to date. They are still ordering takeout because they're working 996 and there just isn't time to shop and cook when you work that hard. They are taking a little bit of the overtime pay or the pay for their second job to make up for the expense of buying takeout. It is overall a net gain. Even if they are destroying themselves trying to keep up with this insane madcap pace of ove
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Dating sucks anyway. All they want to do is talk about their gold CFDs and crypto investments. And how do they ALL have an aunt who's an investing expert? Is that a coincidence? Why are they all so positive?
Also, all this texting and still haven't had a single date. It used to be sex first talk later, or maybe not at all.
delivery companies are terrible (Score:3)
but also don't complain about delivery companies if you don't want to spend the money to make your own online ordering and delivering solution.
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I don't think that's a fair line to draw. There were perfectly viable delivery services available before Doordash etc where restaurants organised delivery themselves. It's perfectly reasonable to be frustrated that DoorDash etc seem to have managed to somehow increase prices, reduce quality, and even then manage to lose money.
Hiring servant services to make you feel good. (Score:2)
Hey, I get it, who wouldn't want to have servant appear with your meal at the tap your mobile phone. It makes us feel important and indispensable doesn't it?
The down side is the extra you pay for this service. Someone's got to pay for it, right? The issue is, a significant chunk of the population is blind to this fact, and they even make it worse by using a credit card to pay for the delivered meal, then don't pay the balance off at the end of the month.
The "Live for Today and don't worry about tomorrow" pr
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Don't neglect lunch specials ... you can get a reasonable sized main and salad for $15 (about $20 with tax and 18% tip) in many places in NYC if you go before 3:30pm on a weekday.
Misrepresentative headline change (Score:2)
How did "The Innovation That’s Killing Restaurant Culture " turn into "How Delivery Is Destroying American Restaurants?"
Overpricing on liquor (Score:1)
I've worked in hospitality for years, food costs are (usually) barely covered by pricing but liquor is highly marked up. That's where profit margins lie. Taking food home, people have all the benefits (someone else cooking and doing dishes, delivery) and minimal extra cost (your own beer and wine). Look at the price of a glass of wine at the restaurant ... for two you can get a whole bottle at the liquor store. The restaurant has to either have enough ambiance to keep people there (view, music, li
Counterpoint (Score:2)
You go to a sit-down restaurant:
1) You wait 30-60 minutes to be seated. If it's a really nice restaurant, you may try to make reservations. Nah, nobody does that anymore and the online things are booked a week in advance (Downtown Seattle, I'm looking at you). Nah.
2) If you manage to get seated, the clock has started. They want you in and out in under an hour. The waiter will show up typically just as you've sat and take your drink order, you will see him again in 5 minutes to take your entree order. In som
Re: (Score:2, Troll)
1. I live in NYC, probably the most crowded market. I've seldom waited more than 5-10 min to be seated, often seated immediately. I've never made stinking reservations - I don't have the mental ability to plan that far ahead.
2. Give the waiter the death stare and be curt. They'll usually get the message to leave you alone for a bit unless you need something.
3. This being said, one of the things that's nicer about European culture vs United Stinkian is that you're not hurried as much by anyone. This i
Everyoen who applauded the COVID shutdowns? (Score:2)
The governments you had elected decided to kill the middle class and the non-corporate businesses by shutting everything down, while the masked massess sung their praises.
Deal with the consequences now. Querian shutdown? COME SHUTDOWN, CARAJO!
Fucking people forget for every action (shutting the economy down) there is an equal, and opposite reaction (people stay home and won't come back to your restaurant.)
think on that next time. If there is a next time. I fear 2020 broke the world and it won't back to
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The weird thing is that, in countries with much harsher lockdowns than the US (most of EU), in-person socialization, work, transit usage bounced back much quicker than the US. People just wanted the lockdowns to be over and go back to pre-COVID days. They didn't gradually come to accept a "new normal."
Quality of the food (Score:3)
In my experience, very few items prepared in restaurants can have quality of the delivered item on par with the quality of eating the food inside the establishment (pizza about the only exception I can think of).
As soon as you seal up a cooked meal for transport, the steam gets trapped and makes the food mushy or chewy. It's the same reason people don't often like eating leftovers, the experience not quite the same as a fresh cooked home meal.
That doesn't even take the extra cost into consideration. In a bind I may get a pizza delivered or a sandwich from Jimmy Johns but beyond that, not a chance.
I don't under why you want cold overpriced food! (Score:2)
I have never used a delivery service, like Uber Eats or Door Dash. I know many people who do, and love them, but what are you getting for the increased fees?
Let's fairly extract those with disabilities, who can't really go out to eat, as they have a good reason for using Uber Eats or Door Dash.
What about people who are just lazy? Uber Eat, which on going is going to represent all delivery companies, is the new Drive Through. The Drive Through on its own is an idiotic concept, and it changed restaur
And extra wait in-person. (Score:2)
You get into line as the first person when the doors open for lunch. But the staff are all busy fulfilling online orders for delivery drivers who won't show up for another ten to fifteen minutes. That's customer service~
Volume (Score:2)
I was at a local Indian place the other day for some lunch off-hours.
In the 20 minutes I was there they had three tables going and four takeout orders.
The idea that they are losing money on every order is silly. They wouldn't participate.
Even if they're breaking even (doubtful at $4 per samosa and $16 for chickpeas and rice) they can get better pricing on their inputs in larger volumes.
If they do better as a business by catering to an affluent crowd that doesn't want to go out then that's good for me becaus
old again (Score:4, Insightful)
Here I am, old again. In my day, restaurants that did delivery had their own drivers. There was one you've probably heard of that once guaranteed delivery in 30 minutes or less. Planning your own business needs instead of just relying on someone else, shocking idea in 2025.
There are lots of restaurants that refuse to use those high priced and crappy delivery services. Dine-in and Pickup Only can be a valid choice too.
Complaining that you rely on other and they charge too much is just lame. Stop acting like your business is frozen in time but things around it change.
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Most restos worth going to in NYC still have phones. I just call up, pay cash (I like to encourage the "gray economy"), pick up in person on the rare occasion where I don't sit down and dine in.
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Why the hell would I sit in a restaurant to eat food? More often than not, the music is shitty and/or too loud, there's a baby or two screaming its head off, a toddler running around unrestrained and unparented, and a gaggle of boomers all coughing up lungfulls of covid.
Compared to delivery or take-out, where I can eat in the peace of my own home, maybe put on an episode of star trek, and actually enjoy the food.
back when baby sisters worked for minimum wage (Score:2)
For parents the nice thing about a restaurant is that there is probably not children screeching there versus guaranteed to be at home.
Re: old again (Score:2)
Because some people attract women?
Re: (Score:2)
Ah yes, the time honored tradition of "picking up chicks at Applebees"
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> Ah yes, the time honored tradition of "picking up chicks at Applebees"
You can - they have a bar section.
It is interesting that this is being blamed on delivery services. That might have a part, but most places have take out as well. A 30 percent delivery charge is silly.
The elephant in the room is that dating is just about dead. You know, where men and women would go to enjoy a nice evening together. In today's world, few men are acceptable to most women, and average men have decided to not waste their money on women who are markedly superior, know it and are not afrai
Re:old again (Score:5, Insightful)
> Why the hell would I sit in a restaurant to eat food?
Because, by the time the food has spent 30 minutes in a bag on its way to you, the texture is terrible, destroying the experience.
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^^^ This.
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Oh, and I forgot. If your 'tip', the ordinarily voluntary but expected and traditional contribution, doesn't meet the expectations of the delivery person, They may or may not actually give you the food you paid for.
The expanded tip culture is a pox.
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One more reason why I don't use services, prefer to always tip (and pay) in cash ... no point in the useless chuds in DC getting a cut and using it to over-fund ICE even more. Support the cash economy, be part of the problem.
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>> Why the hell would I sit in a restaurant to eat food?
> Because, by the time the food has spent 30 minutes in a bag on its way to you, the texture is terrible, destroying the experience.
Exactly. If I want shitty cold food, I'll cook it and let. it sit 30 minutes to get cold and soggy. Gross.
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> Because, by the time the food has spent 30 minutes in a bag on its way to you, the texture is terrible, destroying the experience.
Yes, 100% this. The delivery services are part of the enshittification epidemic. Somehow (covid played a big role) it became acceptable to pay a considerably higher base price, plus delivery fees, plus the expected tip, for soggy tepid food.
The restaurants aren't blameless either. I used to order Uber self-pickup sometimes when they offered 50% off promos and stuff, which even with their markup would be below menu price. Restaurants do things like put hot dishes on the bottom of a paper bag and then put
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"...are part of the enshittification epidemic."
No, the enshittification epidemic is the Cory Doctorow grift being pushed weekly.
But food delivery is definitely a race to the shittiest service possible for the highest price. It's the Silicon Valley experience.
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Some people are perfectly happy never leaving their home, never going outside, never interacting with anyone they don't see every day, all the time.
Most people, however, are not. Sometimes, "going out to eat" is more about "going out" that it is "to eat."
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> Why the hell would I sit in a restaurant to eat food? More often than not, the music is shitty and/or too loud, there's a baby or two screaming its head off, a toddler running around unrestrained and unparented, and a gaggle of boomers all coughing up lungfulls of covid. Compared to delivery or take-out, where I can eat in the peace of my own home, maybe put on an episode of star trek, and actually enjoy the food.
Perhaps it's just my age, but I remember when dining out - especially in the evening - was an event. And even in "greasy spoon" restaurants, screaming children were a relative rarity - parents back then were mindful of their kids' impact on other diners. If there was music, it was background - soft, unobtrusive, and just enough to take the edge off any silences there might be.
What constitutes good manners in public has changed a lot since then, and mostly the change hasn't been for the better IMO. Being con
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",,,and a gaggle of boomers all coughing up lungfulls of covid."
Which they got from young people. Old people did not spread COVID, they died from it.
You can tell a lot about a person from how casually they expose their bigotry trying to be clever.
Pizza Pizza! Soup Soup! (Score:1)
I suspect business will have to adjust so that they don't have to fork so much over to the delivery services. Exactly how has yet to be worked out.
What if for example Denny's merged with DoorDash, then DennyDash doesn't have to pay out the "middle fees".
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Then only Denny's (shit food, literally) would get the discount and everyone else gets fucked. I guess the real solution is to go back to delivery people paid by the restaurant itself (assuming it has enough business to afford it), like Chinese places and pizza joints in the 90s.
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The problem with dedicated delivery is that doesn't take advantage of the efficiency of scale. One driver can potentially do more servicing per mile the more nodes in the org's network.
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I believe this to be false. A 3rd party service does not save a company money, it saves them work, and there is little economy of scale in delivery. A small restaurant that cannot afford a dedicated driver can offer deliveries through 3rd parties, but larger delivery-centric ones have better efficiency on their own.
If you've ever worked for a delivery-only place, which I have, you'd be surprised just how efficient delivery can be, particularly when the employees know the best ways to route drivers and com
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> There are lots of restaurants that refuse to use those high priced and crappy delivery services.
I rarely use delivery myself; for me most of the point of eating out is the "out" part. But among the people I know who use delivery a lot, their starting point for ordering food is the delivery service app, and they choose who they order from mostly based on the user reviews. Restaurants that refuse to join are just invisible to people who primarily use delivery services.
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>> There are lots of restaurants that refuse to use those high priced and crappy delivery services.
> I rarely use delivery myself; for me most of the point of eating out is the "out" part. But among the people I know who use delivery a lot, their starting point for ordering food is the delivery service app, and they choose who they order from mostly based on the user reviews. Restaurants that refuse to join are just invisible to people who primarily use delivery services.
And if you are trying to find a date like people used to do, maybe the delivery guy or girl will put out - I mean, they are already at your place.
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> There are lots of restaurants that refuse to use those high priced and crappy delivery services. Dine-in and Pickup Only can be a valid choice too
A lot of these scummy delivery services will add you if you do take-out whether you like it or not. The business has no say in the matter. There was one (Postmates or something) that absolutely refused to remove the place I was working, and if we didn't pick-up when they showed up on caller id, the dispatcher would just call from a private phone.
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Tell the dispatchwhore that whatever they're trying to order is unavailable and hang up. Rudeness is an option when dealing with people who don't take "fuck off" as an answer.
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> Rudeness is an option when dealing with people who don't take "fuck off" as an answer.
I disagree. It's not optional at all, it's mandatory.
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Unfortunately, that was attempted, and not a real great idea. If you spoke to them at all (like, even to cuss them out) you could pretty much guarantee a delivery person would be in front of you 20 minutes later begging you to make whatever so they could get paid (while you were attempting to make food for your actual customers). If you put your foot down and told them to fuck off, they would call in to dispatch, then your phone would start ringing off the hook again .
Basically, they would harass you until
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Spill some fish sauce or something else similarly stinky on the delivery person's bag by "accident." Also, don't tell them to fuck off ... just ignore them entirely and make them wait. Or keep forgetting their order and making them wait another hour.
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Nowadays, I can order food for the family, one orders Indian, one Chinese, one French, one Japanes and they get all picked up by the same delivery guy.
In the olden days, we had to make our choice on ONE.
In some places, there a ghost kitchens that cook everything French, Italian, Chinese etc and they don't even HAVE a restaurant.
Maybe in the future every block will have one like that instead of 1500 unused kitchens.