Desperate to Stop Waymo's Dead-End Detours, a San Francisco Resident Tried an Orange Cone with a Sign (sfgate.com)
- Reference: 0179831300
- News link: https://tech.slashdot.org/story/25/10/19/1914248/desperate-to-stop-waymos-dead-end-detours-a-san-francisco-resident-tried-an-orange-cone-with-a-sign
- Source link: https://www.sfgate.com/local/article/desperate-sf-residents-want-block-autonomous-cars-21104900.php
On an orange traffic post, the home-made sign declares "NO WAYMO - 8:00 p.m. to 8:00 a.m," with an explanation for the rest of the neighborhood. âoeWaymo comes at all hours of the night and up to 7 times per hour with flashing lights and screaming reverse sounds, waking people up and destroying the quality of life.â
[2]SFGate reports that 1,400 people on Reddit [3]upvoted a photo of the sign's text :
> It delves into the bureaucratic mess â" multiple requests to Waymo, conversations with engineers, and 311 [municipal services] tickets, which had all apparently gone ignored â" before finally providing instructions for human drivers. âoePlease move [the cones] back after you have entered so we can continue to try to block the Waymo cars from entering and disrupting the lives of residents.â
>
> This isnâ(TM)t the first time Waymoâ(TM)s autonomous vehicles have disrupted San Francisco residentsâ(TM) peace. Last year, a fleet of the robotaxis created another sleepless fiasco in the cityâ(TM)s SoMa neighborhood, [4]honking at each other for hours throughout the night for two and a half weeks.
Other on Reddit shared the concern. "I live at an dead end street in Noe Valley, and these Waymos always stuck there," another commenter posted. "It's been bad for more than a year," agreed another comment. "People on the Internet think you're just a hater but it's a real issue with Waymos."
On Thursday "the sign remained at the corner of Lake Street and Second Avenue," notes SFGate. And yet "something appeared to have shifted. "Waymo vehicles werenâ(TM)t allowing drop-offs or pickups on the street, though whether this was due to the home-printed plea, the cone blockage, or simply updating routes remains unclear."
[1] https://www.google.com/maps/@37.7868886,-122.460491,3a,75y,7.36h,84.08t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sKNmd0iHQeKqq2DhWO-7s1Q!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D5.920000000000002%26panoid%3DKNmd0iHQeKqq2DhWO-7s1Q%26yaw%3D7.36!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MTAxNC4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D
[2] https://www.sfgate.com/local/article/desperate-sf-residents-want-block-autonomous-cars-21104900.php
[3] https://www.reddit.com/r/sanfrancisco/comments/1o4cbms/i_dont_think_they_can_read/
[4] https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/honking-waymo-robotaxis-viral-livestream-19753202.php
Easy to make it a bigger problem they HAVE to fix (Score:4, Interesting)
If its simple to keep robotaxis from entering, should be just as easy to fool them into not being able to leave.
See how many of them you can collect there until actual people are forced to retrieve them.
Betting THEN the programmers would suddenly discover enough time to update the maps of that area
Re: (Score:2)
During the protests in Los Angeles earlier this year protestors kept setting Waymo taxis being summoned to the area on fire until the company stopped allowing them to go there. Waymo will be far more incentivized to solve that problem than someone herding robotaxis.
Re: (Score:2)
That's true, but those people could be charged with criminal offenses. You'd be far less likely to face criminal charges for blocking a bunch of vehicles.
Re: (Score:2)
> should be just as easy to fool them into not being able to leave.
Your proposal is more difficult, less effective, and legally riskier:
* More difficult, because you need to stay awake, wait for the car to enter, then put the cone behind; then repeat the procedure with more Waymos; then herd your angry circling reverse screaming Waymos so they stay stuck behind a single cone. (Maybe someone will vibe code that game.) In the other option you put a cone and you're done.
* Less effective, since the whole purpose was to sleep in peace, and you're not sleeping. Plus the reverse
Re: (Score:2)
> Less effective, since the whole purpose was to sleep in peace, and you're not sleeping.
Less likely to be a problem if you make it a game the whole neighborhood can play.
That's already accounted for (Score:1)
They have remote drivers used to make corrections as needed. If you did something like that then they would quickly find you and arrest you. I'm sure they can find something they can charge you with. If not then you can bet by the end of that week there will be a law because there is billions of dollars at stake. Hell maybe trillions. If you consider the value of replacing every single professional driver..
When you cause problems for corporations and rich people those problems get fixed very quickly.
Logging incidents (Score:2)
Do waymos not log incidents that happen like getting stuck somewhere? One would think after so many incidents happening at a location someone would review and flag for waymos to never use that route.
Re: (Score:2)
What if someone doesn't like their neighbor? You want them to arbitrate every personal dispute in a community?
Re: (Score:2)
> Waymo will fix this issue no doubt
Well, people have been complaining about this exact problem on these specific streets for a year or longer. Since you didn't specify a timeline, your statement will only be false if all human life is extinguished and Waymos are still getting stuck down this road, but in the meantime what the fuck is taking so long? You can be damned sure that this wouldn't be going on if any Waymo executives lived on one of these streets.
> I am sure they dont want their cars wasting time a
Just put ... (Score:2)
> Please move [the cones] back after you have entered so we can continue to try to block the Waymo cars
... [1]safety bear [youtube.com] on the job.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGgM3c1e8vQ
The disabled person ... (Score:2)
> Waymo vehicles weren't allowing drop-offs or pickups on the street,
... living at the end of that street is going to be pissed.
On the other hand, is there any chance that summoning a Waymo to these addresses is a prank?
Re: (Score:2)
Main entrance for the both buildings is on the main road, only some service entrances and garages in the dead end.
Traffic control (Score:2)
Traffic control, including what vehicles can use which roads is a solved problem. There are standard road signs that tell human drivers the rules of the road. Car companies have spent a fortune in developing computer vision algorithms to read signs meant for humans.
As semi and fully autonomous vehicles become more prevalent, traffic control signage should adapt. The addition of QR codes to existing signs, or additional signs, that specify rules of the road seems to be an obvious (to me anyway) progression.
Offtopic, but... (Score:2)
WHY is the formatting so awful?
WTF is isnâ(TM)t
Re: (Score:1)
The forum software has trouble with character encoding, to put it mildly. Handliing encoding can be a kind of a black art, but Unicode has been around for how long now? Like 38 years?
Re: (Score:2)
Mojibake. Unicode was introduced decades ago, but Slashdot format for it is still atrocious. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mojibake
Re: (Score:3)
Just a guess... They're public streets?
Re:What gives them the right (Score:4, Interesting)
> and 311 [municipal services] tickets, which had all apparently gone ignored
Then how about they pay public fines? If I had 311 and 11 tickets for the same thing I 'd be forced into court, I would be losing privileges.
This whole thing is really about an imbalance of power where the powerless get stepped on and rich corporations do whatever the fuck they want. Personally, if that was my neighborhood, I would be rolling out spike strips when they back out. If they won't follow any rules and won't pay fines, then assholes can buy fucking tires. Asshole corporations are experience street justice here, of the most gentle kind.
Re: (Score:2)
> Just a guess... They're public streets?
Even in the US I think public roads can be designed for "no entry except for local residents".
Re: What gives them the right (Score:2)
The government permits them to operate. The vehicles are licensed for instance. If the citizenry don't like it, then can complain or vote out thier representives. If noise orders are being violated by Waymo, then get the courts involved.
If there is truely no peaceful process to resolve the conflicts, then giving up on having a society is always an option of last resort. Most vigilentes jump straight to this stage because it seems romantic in thier miswired little brains.
Re: (Score:2)
> If noise orders are being violated by Waymo, then get the courts involved.
The signs say "NO WAYMO" from 8pm to 8am. I don't know about San Francisco specifically, but I'm doubtful any applicable noise ordinance is effective at 8pm - most places they seem to kick in anywhere from 10pm to midnight.
I have no doubt this is really an issue for the residents. It's just that there's no real detail in the story, so it's hard to know whether these Waymo vehicles actually are violating any ordinances.
Side note... looking at the photo of the dead end "street" (more of a stub) that's in the
Re: (Score:2)
> The signs say
Most cities have laws against putting up permitted signs. I ignored the signs in the article entirely because I don't really care what they say on them.
> but I'm doubtful any applicable noise ordinance is effective at 8pm
SF doesn't put hours on the noise ordinance, at least what I can see from reading it. It has enough wiggle room to define almost anything as a noise that the city could regulate, especially if it exceeds 35 dBA ambient or continuous noise inside a residential apartment. But the ordinance also doesn't specifically mention honking cars. It does specifically me
Re: (Score:1)
They're public streets.
Re: (Score:2)
Watch, their network of lawyers, rich, elite, and nepos will change the rules as they go along to suit them. Upset a few power players and the laws change like the wind direction. Catering, brown nosing, and ass kissing to the most powerful
Re: (Score:2)
Most countries have done sort of public nuisance law because you cannot cover every possible way today people might unreasonablely disturb others.
So they probably don't actually have the right, but you know big companies don't really have to obey laws.