Australia, With No Auto Industry To Protect, is Awash With Chinese EVs (msn.com)
- Reference: 0176614439
- News link: https://tech.slashdot.org/story/25/03/04/1842209/australia-with-no-auto-industry-to-protect-is-awash-with-chinese-evs
- Source link: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/australia-with-no-auto-industry-to-protect-is-awash-with-chinese-evs/ar-AA1Ad86X?
The Biden administration imposed a 100% tariff on Chinese EVs to shield U.S. automakers from what it termed unfair competition. U.S. officials also blocked Chinese vehicle software over security concerns that Beijing could use internet-connected cars for surveillance. Australian authorities are monitoring U.S. developments but remain noncommittal despite security experts urging restrictions on Chinese connected car technology.
[1] https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/australia-with-no-auto-industry-to-protect-is-awash-with-chinese-evs/ar-AA1Ad86X
and yet no where to service them.... (Score:2, Interesting)
I live in Oz.
there is bugger all places to service them, and you can be sure as shit it will be hard to get parts.
I look after an Australia Wide vehicle fleet - we are sticking with Toyota's
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There are plenty of places in the capital cities, where 90% of us live.
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I wish this wasn't AC. This. This, this, and this 10 more times. Most people want to keep their cars 10 or even 15+ years. Chinese car companies are like the Google of the auto industry. They make cool, interesting products, they innovate fast and make changes constantly. But they also abandon hardware support after just a few years. That's fine when we're talking about a 300 dollar tablet or a free-tier software service. It's a much bigger problem when you can't get replacement parts for big piece of hardw
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Isn't part of the appeal that they aren't mechanically complicated? It sure seems like the sort of thing that would be easy to kitbash if it isn't all DRM'd to hell and back.
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Yes. People just insist on treating these things like they’re ICE cars, and they’re not. They just don’t break down at anything like the same rate
World... (Score:4, Insightful)
World, with no X industry to protect (any more) is awash with American Xs.
Or was, until some stupid cunt raised tariffs.
Re:World... (Score:5, Insightful)
No, its because we are seeing the cuntish behaviour of the current US government with their tariffs on everything now and refusing to buy American just because we can.
This website has so many times over the past 25+ years called for people to boycott products because of some behaviour or another - and thats whats happening right now with American goods, people are choosing other things now.
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100% correct.
I cancelled all my US based subscriptions the moment Trump was elected.
I will no longer buy US goods or services
I have now been buying from the EU/UK/Aus/Asia instead.
The problem with losing customers is that often the build a relationship with their new supplier and they never come back.
Re: World... (Score:2)
Yeah. Give us our electtons back.
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Ouch, comedy killed by a typo. "Electrons"? "Elections"? "Which did he mean?" :)
(Assuming it was "electrons") I was going to to say that your post comes off as being negative.
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I think this is something most people in the USA don't understand. There is very little the USA exports which can not be imported from another country. When the USA starts making things difficult you simply switch focus to more stable countries.
I'm working a new product that will reach market this year. Normally the USA would be one of the first countries to target to export to. Currently it is not even on our list, the European market is a similar size and much easier to deal with. Maybe we will of
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> This is also bringing the US back more to parity with most other countries out there that for decades have been putting tariffs on US goods while the US had little to no tariffs on the goods coming from those countries.....
I've seen this claim thrown around a lot recently. What was the tariff situation between the the US and the countries currently being targeted prior to Trump's actions? I honestly have no idea but you seem to.
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>> What was the tariff situation between the the US and the countries currently being targeted prior to Trump's actions? I honestly have no idea but you seem to.
> Canadian here. We did this exact same thing 8 years ago. We just all assume Trump forgets.
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Yup, you folks responded to US sanctions with sanctions of your own just like this time [1]https://www.business-standard.... [business-standard.com] . What were you getting at with that?
[1] https://www.business-standard.com/world-news/us-canada-trade-war-trump-tariffs-mexico-china-2018-125030400215_1.html
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Sorry, I didnt mean "sanctions". I meant tariffs.
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After the last time we all re-negotiated the US-Canada-Mexico trade agreement, and here we are again. The lesson is that Trump's word (and thus any contract with the United States) is worth nothing. The entire world needs to keep that in mind going forward.
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Agreed. It's a little scary having him as president and I've never felt that way about one.
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sure because applying tariffs on raw materials you don't produce sure is going to work great.
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> sure because applying tariffs on raw materials you don't produce sure is going to work great.
So, we force ourselves to start producing them domestically...again in some cases.
Re:World... (Score:4, Informative)
So pissing off allies and formerly good trading partners is part of some brilliant strategy? I guess we can spin up a new automotive manufacturing facility in the next week or so...
80% of the potash critical to farming comes from Canada. [1]https://archive.ph/SCYDU [archive.ph] Farmers would be up shit creek if that was shut off.
[1] https://archive.ph/SCYDU
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If potash becomes a critical situation; we are few DPA orders from having all we need available. We can also easily accept lower yields by just using a lot less of the stuff. The price of box of cereal can stay low, if we just stop USAID from competing for it.
Meanwhile Honda is already moving production back to the US.
We have trade deficits with most of these 'partners' aggregate American wealth isn't helped by these 'allies' for the most part. Hell the 300B we have flushed down the Ukrainian hole, would
Re:World... (Score:5, Informative)
> If potash becomes a critical situation; we are few DPA orders from having all we need available. We can also easily accept lower yields by just using a lot less of the stuff. The price of box of cereal can stay low, if we just stop USAID from competing for it.
> Meanwhile Honda is already moving production back to the US.
> We have trade deficits with most of these 'partners' aggregate American wealth isn't helped by these 'allies' for the most part. Hell the 300B we have flushed down the Ukrainian hole, would do plenty to help the American family!
Might want to check your numbers my friend. [1]https://www.cfr.org/article/us... [cfr.org]
We give way more to Israel and I seem to recall when republicans hating Russia back in the 80s. Ol' Ronnie Reagan is spinning in his grave now with orange jesus parroting Putin talking points.
[1] https://www.cfr.org/article/us-aid-israel-four-charts
Re: World... (Score:2)
300 billion?!
Ah yes, from the Trump school of making shit up.
Now, did you give this 3 trillion to a dictator.
Or not?
potash is the nuclear option (Score:2)
Canada will never threaten not to sell potash to the USA. Stopping the sale would cause a 2-3% drop in US farm yields. The USA would continue feeding the same amount to their livestock and converting to methanol. Americans are rich. They would likely eat the same. The US exports though might fall by half. That pushes poor people all over the world to starvation. We would then have a domino affect of countries banning food export. In 6 months Canada would have made enemies of 90% of the world popula
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yeah because no american product is made with any imported parts or components, moron.
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The same thing the US did since WWII when countries/trade blocs imposed tariffs on America goods: nothing.
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"American" , stupid typoes.
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The US got the benefit of the dollar acting as the world's reserve currency and the attendant economic stability. In exchange, it was necessary for the US to run a trade deficit to ensure an outflow of US dollars.
What do we have to protect? (Score:4, Interesting)
What do we have to protect anyways? Most of the US auto industry is barely interested in electric.
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> What do we have to protect anyways?
Terrible quality vehicles that would need a commercial drivers license in most of the world. We can fit SIX grocery bags into this Ford F-250!
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> We can fit SIX grocery bags into this Ford F-250!
Hey, we like what we like....
The US is a LARGE country, with lots of roads, cities, different terrains and well....the people have freedom to buy what they like and want.
Frankly, I myself am not a truck or SUV person...I've never owned anything in my life but 2-seater manual transmission sports cars.
But, I do swap keys with friends with trucks on the few times here and there I need something with hauling capacity....so, nice they are out there, but that'
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So these vehicles aren't poor quality, over priced, and over sized because freedom?
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> So these vehicles aren't poor quality, over priced, and over sized because freedom?
I dunno about the quality, like I'd mentioned, I've only owned 2-seater manual transmission sports cars all my life.....but my friends' truck and SUVs seem to be nice enough quality wise...they get the job done. I find them nice to borrow when I need something with hauling capacity from time to time. (It's hard to carry 3-4 40lb sacks of live crawfish when I want to have a crawfish boil in my backyard to party with friends)
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Right, no one buys a large truck because of dumbshit identity stuff.
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> Right, no one buys a large truck because of dumbshit identity stuff.
Hey, a person likes what they like, eh?
What's wrong with that?
I mean, I doubt MOST people need a corvette or Porsche 911 Turbo.....but, nothing wrong with someone that wants one and drives one if it makes them happy.
Why would you care what makes them happy?
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The hauling capacity is not overwhelmingly good with U.S. trucks. Instead, it is artificially made to look good by underrating the hauling capacity of cars. A Volkswagen Golf for instance is rated with zero towing capacity in the U.S. (towing not recommended), and the same Volkswagen Golf is rated with up to 1800 kg (nearly 4000 lb) towing capacity for braked loads in Europe. Truck beds are amazingly short and not well suited for instance for IKEA hauling - something my compact station wagon has no problem
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> The hauling capacity is not overwhelmingly good with U.S. trucks. Instead, it is artificially made to look good by underrating the hauling capacity of cars. A Volkswagen Golf for instance is rated with zero towing capacity in the U.S. (towing not recommended), and the same Volkswagen Golf is rated with up to 1800 kg (nearly 4000 lb) towing capacity for braked loads in Europe. Truck beds are amazingly short and not well suited for instance for IKEA hauling - something my compact station wagon has no problem
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> The US is a LARGE country, with lots of roads, cities, different terrains and well....the people have freedom to buy what they like and want.
> What a unique country! Roads AND cities?
I think you missed the LARGE part of my statement....in that we have plenty of room to drive and park LARGE vehicles if we want them, and apparently a lot of US citizens want them.
Re: plenty of space vs. true cost of free parking (Score:2)
Come to Boston, NYC, or really any American city with multilevel parking garages.
Parking ramps aren't designed to accommodate the weight or fire hazard of electric vehicles. In many communities they are long past their best by date and not even up to being structurally sound when empty.
For example NYC has loads of 100+ year old garages and has only implemented inspections in the past couple years. Something that will take a decade to accomplish. Meanwhile, a lot of these structures are brittle as a ho
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> What do we have to protect anyways?
Won't somebody please think about the poor Elon?
Re:What do we have to protect? (Score:5, Interesting)
> If we go into a war situation we are going to take those car factories and convert them into factories for building tanks and jets and other weapons we need.
This isnt the mid 20th century anymore, this conversion would not work out very well. A simple retooling is not going to give these company's the ability to work with modern targeting systems and composite armors, Modern tanks are too complex nowadays for this to work.
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"companies"
So you're just thinking about the tooling (Score:2)
You have to also consider the people. There's also lots and lots of heavy equipment that can and would be used.
Yeah it wouldn't be as quick but it would save months of effort. In a wartime those to months are probably the difference.
I mean really realistically nuclear weapons kind of make all of this a moot point. But we've also been keeping our entire economy going with the military industrial complex since the '50s so there is that. We could pull it but our economy would collapse. They're just isn
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> Yeah it wouldn't be as quick but it would save months of effort. In a wartime those to months are probably the difference.
It's hard to find proper numbers but I very strongly dont think there would be anything to gain from trying to convert these factories. Doubly so for converting anything civilian into making modern war planes as you mentioned above.
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> More expensive actually because you're going to be replacing those tires a lot more often.
Just because the torque is there doesn't mean you have to use all of it every time you are stopped at a red light. Just don't drive like a maniac and the wear isn't that much worse. In exchange, you get to say goodbye to oil changes and brake pad wear.
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I mean yeah you're technically correct but that's just not how people work. And even if you don't the fact of the matter is how heavier vehicle on thinner tires designed to increase range means even if you're not flat footing it all the time you're going to go through your tires much faster. The Cyber truck is an extreme example where I can burn through a set in 7,000 mi but you're still going to get a lot fewer miles out of your tires with an EV just because of physics.
Electric cars just aren't the sol
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This is just complete horseshit from one end to the other.
1. No, people, by and large, don’t drive EVs like maniacs. Take it from someone who lives in a city where there are actually lots of EVs around. People drive them like they drive other cars.
2. Tire wear is not noticeably different. *You* may have fucked up your Cybertruck (which is an absurd vehicle in the first place), but most people don’t have to replace their tires any more often for EVs than for ICE
3. The dirty air we breathe is abso
Re: EV TCO (Score:2)
True, but you still have the weight contribution to tire wear and the quality of the differential to avoid slippage in driving at speed. And with the weight comes higher costs to maintain suspension which will also effect tire wear. The minute particles released from tire wear while driving is significant. For an ICE vehicle, by some estimates, is equivalent to diesel exhaust. Pound for pound, tire wear is going to be greater for an electric vehicle, regardless of driving habits, adding significantly more
wrong (Score:2)
I went from volvo to nissan EV. The EV is way cheaper. I track every detail in a spreadsheet. I drive less than 6000 miles per year. Most the savings are not buying gas. My road tax is double but even with my low amount of driving it's still lower than the gas tax for me. Insurance is the same. I save a bit over $1000 per year with the little I drive. Suspension and drive parts are like any other car but possibly the dealer is ripping me off on maintenance quotes- I do all that myself and literally pay 1
What do Australian mechanics think of them? (Score:2)
Lay opinions aren't worth much as they do not see or engage with machinery the same as users.
What do skilled mechanics with extended experience on those BEV (including crash repair) think of them? How is parts availability, durability and troubleshooting?
Ozzie fritters 10 - 100x the Ford Pinto rate? (Score:1)
I buy cheap chinese stuff because it's expendable with careless, semiskilled labor for the house.
I would not buy disposable cars that incinerate at 10 - 100 x the rate of Ford's old Pintos. Which is what I suspect will happen with accumulated EV mechanical and weather cycles, in battery cycles, vibration, and cumulative minor traffic damage.
One news source suggested that Cyber Truck flammbes were 17x that of the Ford Pinto. If so, I would expect even more from the chinese EVs, short of early aban
Holden (Score:2)
"...Australia, which has no domestic auto industry..."
Australia used to have something of a domestic auto industry.
Holden cars were rarely seen outside of Australia and New Zealand, but the name will still prompt men of a certain age to stare nostalgicically back into the 1970s and remember the stylings of the old Holden Kingswood which was a common sight in those days.
Complacency will be your undoing (Score:2)
True story as told to me by a man who was a VP at General Motors in the 70s. GM sent him to Australia to asses the potential threat of Toyota entering the American market. He spent two weeks there and learned that that before Toyota arrived in their country, the dominant car maker had an 83% market share. After Toyota arrived, that same car maker had a 3% market share. He reported his finding to the GM board in New York. They said "That'll never happen here."
Valid (Score:1)
> U.S. officials also blocked Chinese vehicle software over security concerns that Beijing could use internet-connected cars for surveillance.
Definitely a valid concern.
I hear they are pretty good (Score:4, Interesting)
If you are importing all your cars, might as well import good ones.
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It helps that the chinese EV's are *significantly* cheaper than EV's from western countries.
Re:I hear they are pretty good (Score:5, Insightful)
It helps BYD is a state funded entity. Sell at losses globally as long as granpa Xi keeps funding the losses through government loans. Any chinese company that supports the government agenda becomes a government department to keep going, no matter the P&L
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Like Tesla then...Except BYD cars are better quality and surrounded by less lies and BS.
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I'll just stick with ICE for the foreseeable future...it's just more convenient for me and my lifestyle.
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We do not generate enough electricity anywhere in the world to replace oil...yet. One day perhaps, but not for a long time.
The other issue is heat pumps (Aircon), people are using it summer and winter so hydro reserves have no time to refill with the summer melt.
And more people are getting ride of wildfires , so in goes more heat pumps ...
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Guy in 1907: "We don't have enough oil to replace oats and barley as fuel!"
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Go look at the % of energy needs you country has which are supplied by fossil fuels.
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Who is 'we'? That sounds like a USA problems with there power grid is broken by politics.
This post is about Australia, you know, one of those other countries. Australia in particular is very well set up with a huge amount of solar power available and with a lower population density such that a typical house there has more than enough roof space for a decent size solar array that can run a house, charge a car and run aircon.
I know first hand because that is what I do here in New Zealand. Last year
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I am in NZ.
[1]https://www.energyresources.or... [energyresources.org.nz]
In New Zealand we are fortunate to have renewable energy sources providing most of our electricity (around 82%) and around 40% of our total primary energy. This includes geothermal, hydro and wind.
The other 60% of our energy comes from oil (32%), natural gas (21%) and a small amount of coal.*
Example of one are worthless.
[1] https://www.energyresources.org.nz/oil-and-gas-new-zealand/our-energy-mix
Re: I hear they are pretty good (Score:2)
Agreed. Still have my eye on a 1978 C3 Stingray Corvette. ICE, ICE baby.
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> Agreed. Still have my eye on a 1978 C3 Stingray Corvette. ICE, ICE baby.
I'm still wanting to get and do a resto-mod of a 1976 Trans Am 455 4-speed. Something that gets 10 gallons to the mile.
I'd love to get one and take off all the stuff they were doing at the end to restrict airflow and HP....and open that sucker up, with a modern suspension.
I also like that last year with the round headlights....real vintage looking with the screaming chicken.
I love the old Vettes too....but I had a new C5 6 speed wh
Please, no. (Score:3)
Please leave the classic cars alone. You can buy a modern car that's faster anyway. Modifying something that survived for decades is akin to changing the hairstyle of the Mona Lisa because she's out of style.
These cars represent a period, a style, an engineering design of history. Once ripped apart, you almost can't put it back...all that is lost forever, and future generations won't care about what you thought was cool in 2025. Thin rims, for example [even on pick-up trucks now?], are already star
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> Like Tesla then... Except BYD cars are better quality
LOL, Holy Shit. There's delusional, and then there's... this.
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I have been in both.
Let me know when the Roaster 2 is delivered, so far its only 6 years late
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Tesla have received $38 billion in federal grants from the US government and its CEO is currently a major figure in the government hierarchy.
Plus their cars regularly review poorly.
Which part exactly do you consider "delusional"?
Re:I hear they are pretty good (Score:4, Interesting)
Except BYD is NOT a state funded entity, it is a publicly listed company and operate at a profit. It helps that their cars are actually great quality and exceed the safety levels of most American made garbage.
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Yes, I brought a BYD when I was living in China. It was a great barging and great little car that I enjoyed owing and driving. Unless someone wants to claim the Chinese government has been subsidising BYD for the last 20 years for local sales then it is clear BYD have long known how to make a good car at a cheap price. There is nothing I have seen to indicate that the sale price of BYD is being subsidised, they look inline with what it would cost to make a car of their spec if you remove the fat from the
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That's my understanding too. It's not that they're super high quality, its that they're "good enough" and a LOT cheaper.
Which honestly is holding back EV adoption in western countries. Many people can't afford a new car period - they shop used. Of those that do buy a new car there are a lot of sales on relatively low priced budget cars (ie, the Toyota Corolla). I know plenty of people who would scoff at the idea of putting more than $6k-$7k into a car (they're obviously in the buy used camp).
No EV's on
Re:I hear they are pretty good (Score:4, Insightful)
> I know plenty of people who would scoff at the idea of putting more than $6k-$7k into a car (they're obviously in the buy used camp).
> No EV's on the market can compete anywhere near the price point needed for mass adoption.
And as a double whammy, the lower income people who wouldn't pay more than $7k for a car often also don't have means for home or work charging, so charging an EV is much more inconvenient than fueling up a gas car. And since these people often are paid per hourly rather than salaried, there is sometimes a cost to spending 30 minutes for charging instead of 5 minutes for getting gas.
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Teslas are "good enough" for lots of uber drivers around here but they feel cheap and are always broken. They are like boxes on wheels, which the Prius taxis do just as well. I'm surprised that Teslas made in China were able to sell in China, or did they compete at the same price level?
I haven't driven any Chinese EVs.
Re: I hear they are pretty good (Score:2)
$6k-$7k, at least in europe, doesn't buy you a young used car anymore, it'll be 10+ years old, or have a very high milage and usage damage.
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BEV owners are holding onto their cars longer since they are cheaper to run and maintain. So they are still not flowing thru to the second hand market much yet. Only time will help most second hand buyers.
There are bargains for poor people if you are realistic about what you real needs are, not some imaginary do everything vehicle. My elderly mother who lives on a pension brought a Nissan Leaf for about $5K about 4 years ago. The reason it was so cheap was it was a first gen with a poor range battery
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Some of them are extremely good. And affordable as far as EVs go. Australia also loves yutes (pickups) so there are even some of those appearing and I bet they sell in far greater quantities than the shitty cybertruck, assuming it's even road legal in Oz.
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Yute? Isn't is spelt ute? It is a contraction of the word 'utility'. Whether you think a Cybertruck is shitty or not is a lot down to person taste. However you are very unlikely to see them on the road in countries like Australia due safety concerns such as what happens if they hit a pedestrian. In a practical sense they will have a lot of trouble off road in places like Australia, New Zealand and the UK as their wheel track is too wide to fit the narrow off road tracks that have been cut for the likes
Re:I hear they are pretty good (Score:4, Interesting)
So my two big concerns are first that they cut a lot of safety corners that won't fly in the United States where you have to be able to survive an impact with a Ford expedition.
And second if you do a Google search you'll find plenty of articles where there's solid evidence China is using slave labor to build the things. Not the borderline slave labor that they always use but actual slaves.
I am all for competing on the global stage and all that jazz however the American workers deserve to be able to compete fairly.
Re: I hear they are pretty good (Score:2, Troll)
Cutting safety corners? You mean like how you cannot get a Cybertruck in Europe because it does not meet safety standards?
Re: I hear they are pretty good (Score:5, Insightful)
Well- it doesn't meet pedestrian safety standards.
European cars require the car to absorb a certain amount of energy in an impact with a pedestrian. The Cybertruck will turn them into paste.
It meets driver and passenger safety standards just fine.
Not to denigrate European pedestrian safety standards imposed upon vehicle manufacturers- it's just slightly... mmmh, misleading to just say "safety standards" in the context of a car.
Re: I hear they are pretty good (Score:4, Funny)
So it is a feature, not a bug.
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We're American... so, uh, probably.
One could definitely describe the current cultural trend as toward "giving less of a shit about anyone else wherever possible", so the idea that their vehicle should take damage instead of damaging a pedestrian is probably very anti-MAGA. Trump would call it DEI I think.
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I think it would be woke. DEI is when anyone with a excess of melanin or a pair of X chromosomes gets a job making over minimum wage.
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You might be right.
So the cybertruck is an unmitigated disaster (Score:2)
But it does do pretty well in crash tests for the driver. Yeah it turns pedestrians into paste but is an American if it's one thing we don't give a rat's ass about it's pedestrians.
But we do care about the people inside cars and so we have rigorous safety requirements for them. Yes you can buy a subcompact that is more or less like driving around in a motorcycle if you really really want to but there's a reason those don't sell very well.
When my kid was in college I needed to buy them a card I sprun
Re: I hear they are pretty good (Score:4, Informative)
> Nope, not true.
Yes, true.
> European *driver and passenger* safety standards require the presence of readily deformable front ends that will absorb energy to lessen the impact of a crash on a vehicle occupant.
They sure do.
The Cybertruck meets US safety standards on crumple zone deformataion, so it meets European safety standards on the same.
American cars have famously had more stringent requirements in this regard (which is why US car collectors wanted European cars with their ridiculously unsafe bumpers, rather than American cars with their big safe ones)
> The Cybertruck’s rigid front end made of extremely non-deformable structural steel is one among many reasons why it’s not legal in Europe.
Incorrect.
The specific requirement of deformable sections that pedestrians are likely to survive if it gives are why are where it runs afoul, like the hood.
> The Cybertruck is not safe for those outside the vehicle, but it’s also not safe for those inside the vehicle.
Incorrect.
It has been submitted to crash tests by the NHTSA and received 4 and 5 star ratings.
> Here’s a whole video about the many ways that the Cybertruck doesn’t meet European safety standards (focused on the UK, but true across Europe):
No, there's a video from some jackass content creator on youtube with an opinion about a car and a regulatory regime. I can see you've taken great care to stay informed, lol.
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You appear to know absolutely nothing about European pedestrian safety standards for vehicle manufacture. You appear to barely know anything about US standards (eg that vehicle safety tests in the US largely focus on occupant safety and not pedestrian safety, that the US relies on self-certs rather than regulator-run crash tests, etc). You assert that meeting American safety standards on crumple deformation means that a vehicle also meets European safety standards on crumple deformation, but these standards
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> You appear to know absolutely nothing about European pedestrian safety standards for vehicle manufacture.
Just what I can read.
> You appear to barely know anything about US standards (eg that vehicle safety tests in the US largely focus on occupant safety and not pedestrian safety
That was literally my point, lol.
> You assert that meeting American safety standards on crumple deformation means that a vehicle also meets European safety standards on crumple deformation, but these standards are not identical.
Of course they're not. They're nowhere close to identical.
Particularly since the Euro standards literally include pedestrian safety considerations, and the US standards literally do not.
For one, US crash tests are conducted at 56km/h instead of 50km/h, and a 5 star rating means "very little chance of harm to the passenger" (What the Cybertruck was rated), while the European standards don't come anywhere close to that requirement (but then again, neithe
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> And second if you do a Google search you'll find plenty of articles where there's solid evidence China is using slave labor to build the things. Not the borderline slave labor that they always use but actual slaves.
>
I guess the USA draws the line at child labor. [1]https://www.reuters.com/invest... [reuters.com]
[1] https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-immigration-hyundai/
Re: I hear they are pretty good (Score:2)
Its not that they are children, its that they have small hands to reach into areas adults cannot.
Oh no I'm not happy about any slave labor (Score:2)
But when it comes to the Chinese EVs I can at least get some people to agree with me that we shouldn't be importing them and so I will run with it.
I'm not going to sit here and say just because I can't stop all products made with slave labor from existing in my economy that I'm not going to block the ones I can block. Some of that is moral objections and some of it is practical. I don't think American Auto workers should be forced to compete with literal slaves and I'm smart enough to understand that if
Re: (Score:2)
Thats my 3 concerns with these Chinese EVs. How safe are the electronic and battery systems? How safe are they in the event of an accident? What is their build quality like? Will things just start falling apart on these EVs in a few years?
Re: (Score:2)
I can't speak for other Chinese brands but it is worth noting BYD have been making BEVs for about the same amount of time as Tesla with the e6, [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org], being noteworthy. They are popular as a taxi and have been on the road for many years in large numbers. BYD also even do a decent BE bus. I owned a BYD F0 from 2012 to 2014 and it was a great little car. The build quality was good.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BYD_e6
Re: I hear they are pretty good (Score:2)
Cutting safety corners? Yeah decades ago or really fishy chinese brands, but the regular bigger brands gave even better safetymeasures as Tesla or an european car. Let's not forget, they need to adhere to the safetystandards of the country which it's being sold.
Re: (Score:2)
The correct term is forced labour. It's different to slave labour in that they are not slaves, they do get paid and are not confined to the factory. It's just that they are obligated to take the job. A bit like how people are obligated to take a job or have their benefits cut here, but with the threat of jail and even violence if they refuse. It's part of an effort to destroy their culture by taking people away from working in traditional businesses, and forcing them to adopt Chinese culture instead.
Of cour