Legacy Airlines Are Now Coming For Your Carry-on Bag (telegraph.co.uk)
- Reference: 0175809145
- News link: https://slashdot.org/story/24/12/31/1944255/legacy-airlines-are-now-coming-for-your-carry-on-bag
- Source link: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/news/full-service-airline-hand-luggage-fees/
Air Canada's decision to ban standard carry-on luggage for its lowest-fare passengers from January 3 marks the latest rollback, joining United Airlines, Finnair, and others. Most legacy carriers, including British Airways, Air France, and Lufthansa, have already stripped checked baggage and seat selection from basic fares, signaling an industry-wide shift toward budget airline practices.
[1] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/news/full-service-airline-hand-luggage-fees/
Logical conclusion competing on price (Score:2)
Free tickets anywhere in the world (some fees may apply).
The next step (Score:3)
Next up: Clothing surcharge. You want to fly naked, fine, but if you want to be warm and modest well that's gonna cost ya
Re: (Score:3)
> You want to fly naked, fine
Don't threaten me with a good time.
Re: The next step (Score:1)
No, the next step is fares based on weight. You pay for the cost of the fuel it takes to fly you from point A to point B, plus a healthy margin.
"Ban...carry on luggage" is an odd phrase (Score:1)
From the fine summary:
> Air Canada's decision to ban standard carry-on luggage for its lowest-fare passengers...
That's an odd way to put it. They're not banning carry on bags, they're just unbundling the fee. We don't say Ferrari is banning me from buying their cars just because I don't want to pay for one.
Re: (Score:2)
I would say it's more like Ford is unbundling the rear seats on the Fiesta.
and they will pay for lost, stolen, damaged, bags? (Score:2)
and they will pay for lost, stolen, damaged, bags?
Re: (Score:2)
Don't be silly. It's difficult enough getting Air Canada to issue a refund obligated under the law when they cancel a flight. Just one example: [1]https://www.tripadvisor.com/Sh... [tripadvisor.com]
[1] https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g1-i10702-k13289417-Air_canada_persistently_refusing_to_refund_me_L520-Air_Travel.html
Day trippers? (Score:3)
So, no checked luggage, no carry-on luggage. Are they expecting that you're going to have the return trip on the same day?
It seems like booking a flight is going to turn into 'ordering a pizza.'
Pick your seat option:
Pick your luggage option:
Pick your food option:
Pick your in-flight entertainment option:
Do you want a hot towel?
Re: Day trippers? (Score:2)
You guys are getting food options?
Re: (Score:2)
Couldn't happen sooner. I order Pizza far more often than I fly, and it wouldn't be the first time I've taken a same-day return flight where my luggage needs were minimal.
Ultimately what it leads us to is providing tailored service for the individual, and I'm always for that. I'd happily pay more for extra luggage, but rarely want a meal except on the longest international flights (the 17hr hop from Australia to the Middle East, for instance). And I always provide my own entertainment.
Re: Day trippers? (Score:2)
You will be paying more for extra luggage, so be happy. The problem is that you are not going to be paying less for less luggage.
Re: (Score:2)
We can thank inflation for that!
Re: Day trippers? (Score:1)
True dat
Re: (Score:2)
> So, no checked luggage, no carry-on luggage. Are they expecting that you're going to have the return trip on the same day?
I have done that for one day meetings, but since it was a business trip I was not that price sensitive.
Re: (Score:2)
> So, no checked luggage, no carry-on luggage. Are they expecting that you're going to have the return trip on the same day?
Why not. There are many business travellers doing short hops like this. I myself not even as a business had to do something like this before. Why should I have to pay the same as someone who fills the overhead container to the limit?
I hope flying is going to be more like ordering a pizza. Do you like pineapple on pizza? Not everyone does, that is why we have different options for different people.
Re: (Score:2)
That's pretty much how booking a flight already works. You can, of course, buy seat or luggage later, but there's usually a discount if you buy it at the time of purchase.
There are quite a few companies (with limited success) that will pick up your bags from your home ahead of your vacation and deliver them to your hotel. They will then do the reverse at the end of the trip. However, those services are more expensive than checked baggage.
Time to get a 'luggage vest' (Score:3)
I used one for a period - packed the contents of a second bag into something I wore onto the plane. Got a comment from a budget carrier employee that I was 'obviously an experienced traveller'. I've stopped playing that game in recent years, but it's one that those want to wind up airlines might like to check out. Mine has a large pocket in the back big enough for a laptop!
[1]https://store.meanswhile.net/c... [meanswhile.net]
[1] https://store.meanswhile.net/cdn/shop/files/MW-KT23202_i_1.jpg?v=1684578704
Re: (Score:2)
> I used one for a period - packed the contents of a second bag into something I wore onto the plane. Got a comment from a budget carrier employee that I was 'obviously an experienced traveller'. I've stopped playing that game in recent years, but it's one that those want to wind up airlines might like to check out. Mine has a large pocket in the back big enough for a laptop!
> [1]https://store.meanswhile.net/c... [meanswhile.net]
Yea, I have a Barbour jacket with a game pocket that could easily hold enough clothes for a day or two plus laptop or iPad. Iused to carry my iPad or laptop in it to avoid a snatch and grab thief taking it while walking.
[1] https://store.meanswhile.net/cdn/shop/files/MW-KT23202_i_1.jpg?v=1684578704
Do a Steve Bannon (Score:3)
And wear two shirts.
I'll give you my Carry-on Bag (Score:2)
... when you pry (or take) it from my cold, dead hands
Re: (Score:2)
That's fine, I'll give you your carry on ticket for the commensurate price. You're not being disenfranchised here, just other people are having the option not to pay the same as you.
Suspiciously bulky (Score:2)
I sense that clothing with very large pockets is going to become very popular. Can they make you take off a sweater if it has practically a whole laptop bag built into it?
The bag garment (Score:2)
It is like oil shale being bitumen that you can retort from a mined rock, whereas shale oil is something you recover by "fracking" a shale layer deep beneath the ground.
A garment bag is a piece of soft-sided luggage into which you can pack one or more suits of clothes, whereas the bag garment is a kind of wearable luggage.
Re: (Score:2)
Ahh, where are my mod points when I really need them.
+1 Funny
You made my day.
Re: The bag garment (Score:2)
I also wonder about winter parkas. Some are bulky but necessary in the winter in Canada. Are they going to complain if you take off your parka and put it in the overhead bin?
Re: (Score:2)
They already do. You're supposed to put it under the seat.
Fees should include minimum baggage (Score:2)
Having been bitten by bait and switch luggage costs, including having to pay for carry-on, I feel advertised prices should be mandated to include a standard size carry on. If there is a reduced faire available for just going with a handbag (no larger than a brief case or satchel), then that should be as a discount during purchase.
Re: (Score:2)
Yeah, that would be resonable... but that's not how phycology of marketing works. You add-on something for a price rather than remove (feel of loss) for cheaper. And price comparison for the cheapest... Alas this is 'value-based' pricing not 'cost-based' - another way to extract more revenue. They have no noticable additional cost to haul our bags, the ~20lb is way in noise of average human weight variance and the space is there anyway.
It's nice that most of the cheap brokers now include all fees (taxes, ai
Too Much Unnecessary Complexity (Score:2)
Soon you'll have to swipe your credit card to enter the airplane bathroom.
Ferenginar (Score:2)
Every day we’re getting closer to the business model of the Ferengi home world. The elevator has a fee but you can use the stairs for free. Likewise with a waiting room. Sitting in a chair will cost you but standing is free.
Re: (Score:2)
In Georgia and other former Soviet countries, some older apartment buildings still feature coin-operated elevators.
I did not like it (Score:2)
Lowcost European companies started to charge for overhead hand luggage, maybe ten years ago, and I thought they were just trying to squeeze money out of us.
But to be honest, with time I started to appreciate the new way. You are still free to bring a small luggage which can fit under the seat if it has to, which is enough for a few days trip. And while before ir was always a struggle as the amount of luggage people carried could not physically fit in the cabin, now you're sure that if you pas for hand lugg
Re: (Score:2)
> But to be honest, with time I started to appreciate the new way.
What do you mean "with time"? I was here when that happened. The shift from yet another included item into an optional extra once again reduced fares, to the point where I could fly 1500km through Europe for less than the cost of the train ticket to get to the airport.
You weren't ever being disenfranchised here. Someone else was just offered a lower cost ticket.
Weight based ticket pricing (Score:3)
Just do the fat tax finally and move on already. The weight of the passenger and their shit is directly related to the cost of getting them there. Airlines need to stop dancing around this and just do it. Yea if you weigh 400 lb with a carry on you should pay just as much as the 120lb lady with 5 bags of outfits for the weekend.
Re: (Score:2)
Only if they provide a proportional amount of space. A short old lady may weigh less than a tall middle-aged man, but it's not as if either have any control over their fucking *stature*, yet the latter is expected to fit into an ever smaller seat pitch.
Remove the overhead bins (Score:3)
They slow down loading and unloading and are overall a net minus for airplanes.
Re: (Score:2)
Double decker it then. there is so much unused space above the head.
Re: (Score:2)
> They slow down loading and unloading and are overall a net minus for airplanes.
I suspect you are not a business traveler. Most business travelers don't check luggage (for trips shorter than a week) because if you check a bag, it 1) might get lost, 2) the extra 20-30 minutes to get your bag from bag claim matters to business travelers, and 3) if you miss a connection and need to alter your plans mid-trip, and you have only carry on, changing flights is easy; if you have checked a bag it is very difficult as TSA rules require you to travel on the same plane as your bag and to change the
Can't come quickly enough (Score:2)
I am so fed up with the el cheapo crowd that try to stuff gigantic carry ons on board while their 2nd item which is supposed to be a small personal bag or something is ALSO the size of a carry on. Basically current jets don't have enough carry on space for all the crap people carry on.
No longer look at Basic Economy fares (Score:2)
They've managed to take away so many standard "features" that it's no longer worth it to me to book those lowest-of-all fares. You have to be a serious tightwad to go for them, and then, you end up paying for "regular" economy anyway, once you're done paying for a carry-on and a seat assignment.
Re: (Score:2)
> You have to be a serious tightwad to go for them
Not really. Unbundling is something we have always applauded. This is Slashdot. We don't like the surplus cable channels in our subscription. We don't like apps preinstalled on our phones. Why should we suddenly like the idea of bundled airplane deals? Why pay the upgrade cost for regular if it includes things I objectively don't give a shit about (such as flexibility to cancel a fare or to select my seat)?
Flying is a better experience than it ever has been. You can literally customise it perfectly to your
Airfares are actually lower than the good old days (Score:2)
When you adjust for inflation.
In the 1990s, I used to have to pay about $300 or $350 for a round trip ticket from Houston to Grand Rapids. These days, it's about $600 for that same ticket. But due to inflation, $300 in 1990 is now equivalent to $725. This is one example, but a similar pattern applies to many, maybe most, routes.
Baggage is not a perk! (Score:2)
Baggage is not a perk, unless the author is suggesting we all become nudists.
Race to the bottom (Score:4, Insightful)
As long as fliers go for the lowest fare you can expect more unbundling of items that used to be included in the price. Airplane seats are a perishable commodity so if you can fill the last few seats with rock bottom fares you still come out ahead vs. flying them empty because a competitor was slightly cheaper.
Re: (Score:3)
> As long as fliers go for the lowest fare you can expect more unbundling of items that used to be included in the price.
And given they're selling all those seats, passengers seem to prefer low fares over bundled fares. Personally, I'd rather check a bag than dork around with the overhead bins so I appreciate having the option to not pay for overhead space.
Airlines aren't dumb. The part which sets prices clearly puts a lot of thought into it (if they didn't, the fare structure would be so, so much simpler). If it turns out everyone buys both a seat and an overhead slot, they'll go back to bundling them.
Re: (Score:2)
> If it turns out everyone buys both a seat and an overhead slot, they'll go back to bundling them.
I don't think so. In the same way as a $5 box of breakfast cereal used to contain (say) 48 oz of product but now contains 40 oz for the same price, this is the airlines' way of engaging in shrinkflation.
Re: (Score:3)
Are there any airlines that let you check a bag for free but don't let you have a free carry-on? I think the issue with removing the free carry-on is that most everyone needs some sort of baggage. When I was really young and travelling somewhere for a short (2-3 days) duration in the summertime (light and non-bulky clothes), I could sometimes get away with just a small backpack, but the vast majority of people can't. If 98% of customers need something, then separating it out into a separate charge, reall
Re: Race to the bottom (Score:3)
Also women carry purses but men don't. Are they going to tell women they can't bring purses or tell men only women can bring a bag? Either seems bad
Re: (Score:2)
> Also women carry purses but men don't. Are they going to tell women they can't bring purses or tell men only women can bring a bag? Either seems bad
TFA is behind payall, but I'm guessing it's for bags in overhead but not under seat (yet).
Re: Race to the bottom (Score:2)
Still doesn't solve the problem. Then a guy can bring a laptop bag but if a woman wants a purse with her she can only bring the purse unless she wants to put it in a laptop bag and mostly fill it with their purse?
Re: (Score:2)
> Still doesn't solve the problem. Then a guy can bring a laptop bag but if a woman wants a purse with her she can only bring the purse unless she wants to put it in a laptop bag and mostly fill it with their purse?
It's not a matter of if it's a purse or a laptop bag, it's a matter of if what you bring fits completely under the seat in front of you or if you need it to go in the overhead bin. While of course this may change, currently there is checked luggage, carry on luggage, and personal items. Checked luggage is of course checked, usually for a fee. Carry on goes in the overhead bin (this is the category that airlines are now excluding from bare bones tickets). Personal items go under the seat in front of you. I h
Re: (Score:2)
Don't worry, you can still bring your fanny pack and simply store it under the seat in front of you!
Re: (Score:2)
Women can put their purses in their laptop bag and, as long as it fits in the baggage sizer, they can store the whole of it under the seat in front of them. Women's purses, like pretty much anything else, can act as a projectile if something goes wrong and they need to be securely stowed. It's not a gender issue. Everybody gets the same *volume* of space under the seat in front of them. Either your personal item fits or it doesn't.
Re: (Score:2)
They call purses a "personal item". The rule used to be " One carry-on bag, and one personal item per passenger. "
This was so that a woman could have both her purse and her travel bag. It evolved to one small item (purse, laptop-bag, backpack, etc.) that fits under the seat in front of you as your "personal item", and one carry-on item (typically a larger bag) that fits in the overhead compartment.
Under this new rule, they will charge for an item that goes in the overhead compartment.
Re: (Score:2)
They still include a "personal item" that fits under the seat. So the super light travellers, business types going for a night or two, etc. might benefit. What's really going to happen is that people are going to push that personal item as hard as they can, and toss them all in the overhead bins anyway, just like they previously tried to get away with the biggest carryon possible.
In fact, I suspect that the airlines charging for checked bags motivated the proliferation of huge carryons, which slows down boa
Re: Race to the bottom (Score:2)
People are only bringing bags on the plane because air Canada has a very poor record of losing luggage. If they didn't lose luggage than I would prefer to check the bag too.
Re: (Score:2)
> People are only bringing bags on the plane because air Canada has a very poor record of losing luggage. If they didn't lose luggage than I would prefer to check the bag too.
I'm guessing you actually mean they have a good record of losing luggage, or a poor record of not losing it. :-)
Re: Race to the trains (Score:2)
At least in Europe, train service is improving, but I dont have any hope for North American passenger trains
Re: (Score:2)
> At least in Europe, train service is improving, but I dont have any hope for North American passenger trains
That's because Europe is small, compared to the continental US.
Re: (Score:2)
It's not a race to the bottom as much as it is a race to customisation. Flying is ludicrously cheap now. All the perks of the past are still available and largely for even cheaper than they used to be.
While my local airport taxes and fees put and end to it, only a few years back I was able to fly 1500km for less than the cost of the train fare to the airport. A checked bag (45 EUR) cost more than the ticket (35 EUR), but even combined I don't need to think back very far to find a time when I couldn't get a