Xlibre fork lights a fire under long-dormant X.org development
- Reference: 1750436408
- News link: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2025/06/20/new_version_of_xorg_x11/
- Source link:
Suddenly, over in X11 land, everything seems to be kicking off. As we [1]reported last week , there is a fresh fork of the X.org server called [2]Xlibre , which seems to have stirred up lots of activity.
The project was begun by developer Enrico Weigelt, who had already featured in The Register more than once before this move. About four years ago, [3]Linus Torvalds rebuked him for spreading anti-vaxxer misinformation on the Linux Kernel Mailing List. Weigelt [4]surfaced again a year ago with some patches to improve refresh rate handling on multihead X11 setups, and a new tool he called the "Xorg testing ground," used to build and test the X.org server in a jail. That can now be [5]found on GitHub , as Weigelt's account on Freedesktop.org was closed.
[6]
We must confess to a mistake here. In reporting on the new fork, we referred to him as a long-time X.org maintainer. Some folks from X.org got in touch to point out that this wasn't in fact the case. He only started committing code in early 2024, and was never a project maintainer. We do suspect he's been the single most active developer in that time period, though. We would offer some evidence of this, such as a link to his commits, but along with blocking his account, as [7]Phoronix reports , the X.org team has been busily reverting lots of his merge requests.
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Despite this burst of activity, the team has put out not one but two new releases, both of the X.org X server. On Tuesday, the project released versions 21.1.17 of the X server, and 24.1.7 of Xwayland, due to [10]multiple security vulnerabilities that were discovered back in March, confirmed in April, and fixed this month. It seems they missed one. On Wednesday, these were superseded by [11]xorg-server version 21.1.18 and [12]Xwayland 24.1.8 .
Meanwhile, the new Xlibre project is attracting lots of interest. This month, there have already been [13]dozens of threads on its [14]mailing list . (Interestingly, the list was [15]created back in February , so Weigelt has apparently been planning this for a while.)
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Back then, apart from an initial test message, the [17]only post was one in which Weigelt announced the project's [18]Telegram group . This is called x11dev and has nearly 500 members and many thousands of threads. On GitHub, Xlibre has been starred some 2,200 times.
We can't tell if this is despite its position on diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) and [19]nonexistent Code of Conduct ( ENOENT is Unix-speak for "Error: no such entity") — or because of it. Either way, it's working.
Over on the social network that is now appropriately enough called X, the Devuan project has [20]posted in support of XLibre:
Welcome XLibre! "This fork was necessary since toxic elements within Xorg projects, moles from BigTech, are boycotting any substantial work on Xorg, in order to destroy the project, to eliminate competition of their own products. Classic embrace, extend, extinguish tactics." — Devuan GNU/Linux (@DevuanOrg) [21]June 18, 2025
XLibre shows once again what is happening to the GNU/Linux community and why forks are made necessary by the corporate land-grab of community developments. And they just removed libsystemd-dev dependencies. We will support this effort as much as possible! — Devuan GNU/Linux (@DevuanOrg) [22]June 18, 2025
It feels like anti-Wayland sentiment and resistance are growing. Whether this is despite changes such as [23]GNOME 49, Ubuntu 25.10, and Fedora 43 removing the ability to run GNOME using X11, or because of such changes, is unclear but we suspect the latter. In that story, we linked to a detailed document maintained by Simon Peter, creator of the AppImage packaging format and the [24]helloSystem Mac-like FreeBSD distribution . The title of his list of objections summarizes its content: " [25]Think twice before abandoning Xorg. Wayland breaks everything! ."
It's not just him. We've also previously linked to digital artist [26]David Revoy , who last year published a [27]long, in-depth explanation of why KDE Plasma 6 and Wayland were unusable for him. (To be fair, the [28]newly released Plasma 6.4 fixes some of these issues.)
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Many problems remain, though. Last week, the popular KiCad PCB-layout tool posted a blog post about the program's [30]Wayland support . For Wayland fans, it will make discouraging reading. Some of the gems include:
Wayland does not currently allow controlling window position. This means that when you open KiCad, it cannot remember where you last placed your windows.
It also describes problems with toolbars, multiple window management, dragging things between windows, and much more. It concludes:
These problems exist because Wayland's design omits basic functionality that desktop applications for X11, Windows, and macOS have relied on for decades – things like being able to position windows or warp the mouse cursor. This functionality was omitted by design, not oversight.
And recommends:
If you use KiCad professionally or require a reliable, full-featured experience, we strongly recommend:
Use X11-based desktop environments
Many Wayland critics point out its failings compared to the way people used X11 in the 20th century, its lack of network transparency, for instance. That's true (although [31]Waypipe does enable it to work over a network connection), but it misses some important points. Yes, this was possible, but not essential. The Reg FOSS desk has been installing and supporting Unix boxes since 1988 and has never once needed or used X11 over a network connection.
[32]KDE targets Windows 10 'exiles' claiming 'your computer is toast'
[33]KDE Plasma 6.4 ships with major usability and Wayland improvements
[34]Forked-off Xlibre tells Wayland display protocol to DEI in a fire
[35]OpenMamba: Eat your greens, they're good for you
Secondly, it's much less true of 21st century Linux desktop computers and their modern full-color hardware-accelerated desktops. The way modern X11 desktops work, with 3D compositing using OpenGL, doesn't work over a network either.
These days, the problem is that many of the ways that traditional desktop GUIs work is also incompatible with Wayland. This grumpy old user wants to continue using his [36]standards-based keyboard-driven user interface , complete with [37]matching text editor . We know that many more youthful techies don't use these things, but that does not mean it's acceptable to remove them.
These sorts of features are not just minor unimportant aids for long-time users who are stuck in their ways, they are also [38]keystone accessibility features . In a few decades, those same techies removing uncool features such as keyboard-driven menu bars will discover that they can't see sharply any more and that they keep losing the mouse pointer, or can't see the cursor, or their fingers are too stiff to perform touchscreen gestures, or their hands tremble when they're trying to tap precisely. This happens to everyone. It will happen to you. It's called aging, and it's a horrific experience, but it's better than the alternative. And worse things than just getting old happen. Any number of ailments can take your senses or your limbs. For example, diabetes can take your eyesight – but before that, the endless blood tests numb your fingertips, and the resulting scar tissue means capacitive touchscreens stop registering those fingers. You can still use a stylus, but you can only use one of those at a time, meaning no more multi-finger gestures for you.
The very important [39]principle of Chesterton's Fence applies here. Just because you don't use something and don't need it does not mean that nobody needs it. An alternative that's fine for you may not work for others. They may depend on the thing you're removing. Hamburger menus reduce screen clutter, but a screen-reader can read textual menu bars aloud.
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GNOME Disks, with not one but two hamburger menus. Go on then, which does what? – click to enlarge
A hamburger menu can't be read until it's opened, and to do that, you need to find it first. Title bars are legacy UI dating back to the Apple Lisa. But some desktops, such as MATE, let you roll up windows leaving only their title bar, improving window management. Almost all X11 desktops let you [41]middle-click the title bar to place that window behind all the others. GNOME gets rid of title bars, so neither of these works any longer. One user's clutter is another's essential UI – or worse, you can discover that what you thought was clutter was actually useful. For example, look at the modern GNOME applications that now need two separate hamburger menus, such as GNOME Disks. Which does which? Why do they look different? What do three lines mean compared to three dots? That dull, old-fashioned, single unified menu bar suddenly doesn't seem so terrible.
The Reg FOSS desk is nearing 60, and as a result is totally indifferent to most of the shiny new features that Wayland enables. He doesn't care about high definition, high dynamic range, high and variable refresh rates, tear-free video, and so on, because he is [42]physically unable to see such things through his expensive varifocal glasses. He never uses trackpad gestures because he avoids trackpads, but he uses all seven buttons on his wired USB mouse.
We know that many more youthful techies don't use these things – and that a vocal cohort inside the community, including younger coders, is looking to improve things – but that does not mean it's acceptable to remove them.
Meanwhile, it's all happening. Wayland gains ground; xorg-server witnesses purges of code and contributors, but also new versions, and new offshoots; and that new fork wins legions of supporters, if not as many contributors. It's all go. Change and evolution are good things. History is good, too. Long-lived, often-ported code is code that has won many of the battles of natural selection. Long live X11! ®
Get our [43]Tech Resources
[1] https://www.theregister.com/2025/06/10/xlibre_new_xorg_fork/
[2] https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver
[3] https://www.theregister.com/2021/06/11/linus_torvalds_vaccine_smackdown/
[4] https://www.theregister.com/2024/07/25/xorg_monitor_refresh_rates/
[5] https://github.com/X11Libre/xorg-testing
[6] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_software/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=2&c=2aFXZ91U4pQx-mygyLkn0wAAAAdM&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D2%26raptor%3Dcondor%26pos%3Dtop%26test%3D0
[7] https://www.phoronix.com/news/X.Org-Server-Lots-Of-Reverts
[8] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_software/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=4&c=44aFXZ91U4pQx-mygyLkn0wAAAAdM&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D4%26raptor%3Dfalcon%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[9] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_software/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=3&c=33aFXZ91U4pQx-mygyLkn0wAAAAdM&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D3%26raptor%3Deagle%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[10] https://insinuator.net/2025/06/disclosure-multiple-vulnerabilities-xserver-xwayland/
[11] https://lists.x.org/archives/xorg/2025-June/062065.html
[12] https://lists.x.org/archives/xorg/2025-June/062066.html
[13] https://www.freelists.org/archive/xlibre/06-2025
[14] https://www.freelists.org/list/xlibre
[15] https://www.freelists.org/archive/xlibre/02-2025
[16] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_software/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=4&c=44aFXZ91U4pQx-mygyLkn0wAAAAdM&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D4%26raptor%3Dfalcon%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[17] https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Accounce-telegram-chat-group-about-X11Xorg-development
[18] https://t.me/x11dev
[19] https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/blob/master/CoC.md
[20] https://x.com/DevuanOrg/status/1935307141511794726
[21] https://twitter.com/DevuanOrg/status/1935307141511794726?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
[22] https://twitter.com/DevuanOrg/status/1935307143646769547?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
[23] https://www.theregister.com/2025/06/12/ubuntu_2510_to_drop_x11/
[24] https://www.theregister.com/2021/06/16/hellosystem_maclike_freebsd_project_05/
[25] https://gist.github.com/probonopd/9feb7c20257af5dd915e3a9f2d1f2277
[26] https://www.davidrevoy.com/static2/about-me
[27] https://www.davidrevoy.com/article1030/debian-12-kde-plasma-2024-install-guide#2-the-challenges-and-the-issues
[28] https://www.theregister.com/2025/06/18/kde_plasma_64_released/
[29] https://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/jump?co=1&iu=/6978/reg_software/front&sz=300x50%7C300x100%7C300x250%7C300x251%7C300x252%7C300x600%7C300x601&tile=3&c=33aFXZ91U4pQx-mygyLkn0wAAAAdM&t=ct%3Dns%26unitnum%3D3%26raptor%3Deagle%26pos%3Dmid%26test%3D0
[30] https://www.kicad.org/blog/2025/06/KiCad-and-Wayland-Support/
[31] https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mstoeckl/waypipe
[32] https://www.theregister.com/2025/06/04/kde_windows_10_exiles/
[33] https://www.theregister.com/2025/06/18/kde_plasma_64_released/
[34] https://www.theregister.com/2025/06/10/xlibre_new_xorg_fork/
[35] https://www.theregister.com/2025/06/02/openmamba_green_is_good/
[36] https://www.theregister.com/2024/01/24/rise_and_fall_of_cua/
[37] https://www.theregister.com/2021/12/17/tilde_text_editor/
[38] https://www.theregister.com/2025/05/18/apple_accessibility_features_2025/
[39] https://fs.blog/chestertons-fence/
[40] https://regmedia.co.uk/2024/09/25/fed_41_disks.jpg
[41] https://www.theregister.com/2023/07/05/mouse_button_101/
[42] https://www.theregister.com/2024/12/18/xfce_420_is_out/
[43] https://whitepapers.theregister.com/
Re: X11 over network connection
Ah yes. Long, long ago I took a somewhat-longer-than-usual Christmas vacation with my parents. They of course had a windows computer, not a proper Linux computer. My email then was on my own domain on my home computer (gee, just like now!), and I didn't attempt to allow email access remotely (POP/IMAP). So, I exported my usual session over X. I put a Linux distribution on a USB stick and booted the parent's machine from that. Slow, sure, but access to the X-session at home was all I needed it for. Made my stay much pleasanter. And yes, I only did it a couple of hours a day.
Re: X11 over network connection
"Which seems, on the face of it, petty"
They would be if they weren't causing issues. A lot of his stuff had been handwaved through and upon closer inspection turned out to cause more problems than they solved
I'm not overly defending X11 - it's a shocking mess that needs a ground-up rewrite - but Xlibre is not that rewrite and I don't believe that the fork will last long, simply because of the personalities involved
It's not as if X11 hasn't been forked in the past. Xorg was a breakway from XFree86, which in turn was a breakaway from OSI, etc
The reason that the Xorg devs have been sitting on things for quite a while comes back to the "shocking mess". It's highly doubtful we'll ever have a X12 (I can remember X10) and there are so many increasingly insurmountable security issues with X11 that it was generally considered best to sunset it - this is the primary reason most of the Xorg devs jumped to Wayland when given the opportunity
All that said, given a choice between X and RDP/VNC, I'll take X every day of the week. Those who criticise X on lower bandwidth links haven't had to endure the others.
Re: X11 over network connection
Hell, my very first UNIX experience was on a remote Sun pizzabox, back in 1985. I used a pirated Windows X11 server because they were like $700 at the time and I was an extremely poor student. (is there any other kind?)
(Strictly speaking, that box was for graduate students, and I wasn't really supposed to be on it, but I was friends with the admin, who was a HUGE Dr. Who fan[1])
I have had to maintain boxes located behind other jumpboxes. It's also useful for maintaining the Raspberry Pi in my garage, where I can display its xosview on my local desktop.
A couple weeks ago, I showed the remote xosview trick to a couple of the DBAs at work. They think I'm some sort of genius and I'm going to let them keep their illusions.
[1] Knock, knock. Who's there? The Doctor. Doctor W... ARRRGH (was his sort of humour)
Upvote!
Where do I upvote the article? :-)
A bit off-topic, but triggered by Liam's discussion of menus, etc.
Gnome has no title-bars? Yikes! No wonder I expunged it long ago.
I'm a person with a horrible memory for raw facts. The main reason I like menus (of any kind) is that they LIST OPTIONS. That can readily remind me what the names of the tools I need are. I'm afraid this is especially useful on Linux where geek programmers invent weird and hard-to-remember names for their programs/tools.
I spend the vast majority of non-browser computer time with a shell window and an emacs window. The "search tools" that various systems have are often useless to me since I don't remember the name of the tool I recall using - and I also might not recall the proper search terms to find the tool by function.
Removing the contributions?
I get they (xorg) might disagree with the guy, but why undo all the commits that have been applied? Surely they were accepted because they did something useful?
Is this cutting your nose off to spite your face?
Re: Removing the contributions?
AFAIK it's done automatically by Gitlab.
Re: Removing the contributions?
It's probably easier to just quote the linked Phoronix article...
There was this revert for not handling copyright and license notices correctly. Some existing code macros were moved to a new file while dropping the existing copyright holders from being mentioned in the new file and only adding the new contributor to that header file. The code license was also changed from MIT AND X11 to MIT OR X11.
Seems fair
Also merged this week was this big revert of prior "RandR cleanups" that ended up breaking at least some RandR functionality.
There was also a revert to avoid unnecessarily breaking the NVIDIA driver. It was also commented by NVIDIA that some additional requests for other reverts are coming too.
Both seem fair, especially in the context of 'not breaking things that people use' that seems to be the basis for many Wayland objections.
There were also other reverts for code of questionable value. And other reverts making changes without knowing the prior knowledge for why some macros were added in the first place by X.Org developers.
Again, none of this seems unfair.
It seems the biggest crime might've been letting someone commit code without paying too much attention to what was being committed in the first place. Not ideal, but not that uncommon with old and unfashionable volunteer lead projects. You're happy for the effort and don't spend as much time looking until someone goes 'Have you seen this shit?'
Of course it could all just be a conspiracy by big WM to kill X, but it sounds like a much more prosaic instance of bad code.
As I have said before, Wayland needs more coders and less promoters.
Not allowing to control the window position? Is not like Wayland is new, why the heck is not that implemented yet?
> why the heck is not that implemented yet?
Carsten Haizler, AKA "Rasterman" the Enlightenment developer, has an explanation:
https://lore.freedesktop.org/wayland-devel/20210528001514.d841ddbbe414cc9f8abde4e9@rasterman.com/
Not sure I can adequately summarise it!
The gist is: they want to cater for tiling window managers now, and plan for the future and for things like VR/AR displays. Letting apps control window size would break such displays.
One might well ask if that is worth breaking the way existing tools work, but you know how that would go...
-----
Found via the comments here actually:
https://forums.theregister.com/forum/all/2025/06/18/kde_plasma_64_released/
If I follow the Rasterman explanation correctly it boils down to not allowing some frequently used requirements to be implemented because in use cases where they would be irrelevant (e.e. tiling managers or wrapping a window round a 3D VR bunny) they'd be impossible to implement. Or have I missed something?
You are spot on. They do not implement a feature because they have no clue about and don't care about usability in a broader sense. It all seems to boil down to a narrow-minded development strategy where some group is cut off because a developer doesn't belong to that group.
What's really interesting is that placing a window is 1000% up to the window manager in X11, so the proper window manager can and does handle tiling, and could also handle 3D VR bunnies.
For example, I have some apps that shit the bed because they expect the window title to be at the top, not the side (looking at YOU, Android Studio) so I have FVWM2 set to override their programmatic placement.
So this is a non-issue already in X11 and Wayland needs to keep up.
If you are really concerned about the logical incompatibility then it would be equally reasonable to ban tiling window managers because they can't handle window placement.
Of course, both positions are stupid, because they are absolute.
A more reasonable approach is to allow apps to say "if I can position my windows, here's where I'd like them" or even "it's me again, please try to put me where I was last time". No absolute guarantees, but no ban hammers either.
Fact is, most end-users don't switch between overlapped window managers and tiling ones or VR bunnies, so they don't care about the kind of future-proofing that the designers are aiming for.
I agree with the approach you're outlining being more reasonable than strictly banning either side, but I also don't see the lack of support as a ban so much as an unimplemented feature that wouldn't be beneficial enough to justify the cost of implementing it.
"If I can position my windows, here's where I'd like them" assumes that the application knows something about the compositor it's running on.
"I would like to position my windows, could you tell me about what I need to provide in order to do that?" might be met with:
"Okay, that sounds great! You can place your surfaces within [0, 1) in three dimensions represented as a double, and within [0, 65535] in a quantized fourth. Please ensure that you provide the correct transform matrix to ensure that the window is rotated appropriately. Your window will be removed if it is either nonplanar (as determined by us), nonrectangular within its plane (also as determined by us), if it intersects any other object, or if it is too far from the current viewport."
That entire transaction would need to be codified in an extensible manner so that any compositor could represent their own unique requirements in such a way as could be interpreted by any application aiming to make use of them.
I'm open-minded here because it doesn't really affect me personally, but I'm not convinced that we're losing anything by giving up windows being able to shuffle themselves about. I'd love to have some concrete examples if there are UI design patterns that rely on window manipulation functionality, especially if those patterns are locally optimal means of interacting with the software within whatever domain the program is related to.
Cheers!
Strange. X manages to have tiling window managers and apps which set their windows' positions. I know this because I'm using all three right now.
Has Wayland regressed on something that has been working in X for decades? Say it ain't so!
(For AR displays I have Real Windows with a delightful view of trees and squirrels and sometimes trains which far surpass anything any VR will ever achieve and if this grumpy old git doesn't need it then neither do you)
KiCAD is one of my income producing tools ...
I keep being told that I 'need to switch to wayland', but if it is pulling stunts like stopping key applications from working as they have for a LONG time then it time to stick two fingers up as the people telling me I'M in the wrong.
And yes where DO we upvote such a well produced article!
"This fork was necessary since toxic elements within Xorg projects, moles from BigTech, are boycotting any substantial work on Xorg, in order to destroy the project, to eliminate competition of their own products. Classic embrace, extend, extinguish tactics."
Am I just getting old, but would that kind of statement ever be made by a serious project even a few years ago? Nowadays comments like this get quoted, without even any commentary as to their slight, erm, paranoia?
Who are these 'toxic elements' and 'moles from BigTech', who even is 'BigTech'? Why is there no investigation into this alleged infiltration? Is there any evidence? The amount of times you hear of this kind of stuff yet there's never anyone who's actually been approached by members of these shady cabals, despite literally everything in human history of slight contention having at least one dissenter. I mean I've worked in IT for my entire career, I could do with some cash for retirement, I'm quite open to be corrupted by 'Big Tech' to infiltrate some product or other; but I've never once been approached.... has anyone here? We should really be told.
To my jaded eyes it looks like an over eager but not perhaps as skilled as required developer has contributed enough crap to a fairly dormant project that someone has started to notice.
I assume they're referring to RedHat pushing systemd, pulseaudio, and now wayland as hard as they can.
I get paid extra to put up with their shit and Microsoft's shit.
I don't know about "boycotting" but you try to get a RedHat employee to discuss sysv init.
Been using Wayland for over a month now as a part of Fedora 42
Have noticed ZERO difference in anything. It just works. I don't know what advantages I'm getting over the Xorg server I had been using for years but I do know it is much more actively developed. Who wants to use something where the development until recently was being referred to as "long dormant"? Yes you can argue "if it works why does it need development?" but when everything else around it is constantly changing having such a vital piece of the GUI puzzle remain stagnant is dumb.
I didn't deliberately "choose" Wayland, but I had been using Cinnamon with Fedora for years which has remained on Xorg (I think they are working towards Wayland but aren't there yet) but decided to give another shot at whether GNOME could work for me given the appropriate extensions. I found it had improved greatly on that front and for me it works about 95% identical to Cinnamon (i.e. basically the same bottom bar, the differences are mainly some niggles in how it handles multiple workspaces) So I took the plunge and got Wayland as part of the package - hadn't even thought about that other than the couple times I've read Reg articles that mention it and I was like "oh yeah I guess I'm using Wayland now"
Always get downvoted
for explaining why neither X nor Wayland is suited to remote access in high-security environments.
Still bickering, still not listening. Roll on the ignorant downvoters who never explain why they imagine I am wrong.
Re: Always get downvoted
Many protocols you can wrap it with ssh and port forwarding as needed, and call it a day. Granted, I'll stick to Xvnc and not raw X, but...
Your mileage (and local security requirements) may vary...
Re: Always get downvoted
The particular issue is not about secure protocols as such - a difficult message to get across for some reason. It is about secure architecture and containment of any compromise. A compromised client is one thing, a compromised secure server is quite another.
I feel as though GNOME (3) & Wayland are as one developed from the "we're doing what we want to do" mindset, as though the entire basis of open source were not collaboration, at least with other developers. There are some worthwhile goals they want to achieve, and you can't get some of them except by pushing even when it's hard. But there are grey areas, as well as the total blackness of blind spots.
I did think the thought at some point, that 'what do I care if all x applications can read keypresses, they call come from the repos'. But maybe I do want the web browser not to be able to read what I'm typing into RDP sessions. Is that enough of a benefit to wipe out the *bsd's from the application ecosystem. maybe it won't, but it doesn't work yet.
Which incidentally even on xfreerdp directly, I still can't get to behave with multiple monitors. I have to keep bouncing into X11 for that. To work. Is that important enough? Guess not, fine on their laptop probably. (X11 forwarding not unuseful to get a window, out of WSL either)
Unfortunately the highly shall I say, disassociated politics of the driving agent for this fork (https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/1l9s7rg/comment/mxfigv7/ , not interested enough to find a direct source) make me feel more tantrum than movement.
I still like the principle of X
Letting all the graphics be actually rendered remotely instead of rendered locally, compress, and then decompress remotely. The one big advantage over most other solutions.
And maybe, FINALLY, a free fully functional X-Server for Windows, relatively easy to install.
Firmly in the X11 camp
Been a Unix dev since early 80's and have a large repository of personal stuff I developed since retiring in 2019 based on X11 ...and no.. wayland sucks with it's X11 compatibility even after all these years.
I have been a Unix and now Linux exclusive home for decades (eat my own dog food and wife was a Unix admin so she is part of my party)
The loss of X11 in mainstream distro's would sink me so I have spent a lot of time viewing these developments and future proofing myself.
Downloaded the X11 code (inc libraries) and got most of that to a compile but hit some roadblocks (will revisit at some point).
My go forward platform is Ubuntu server with fluxbox and tint2. I figure that even if desktops like Gnome and KDE drop it and X11 ones like XCFE also do that:
(1) the base X11 libraries will always be provided on server platforms
(2) that X11 based stuff like fluxbox and tint2 will also exist (in fact I compile these from source)
(3) can compile newer gcc and kernels on older distro's to keep them current (until some libc issues arise)
I am also stock piling PC hardware. Worst case I am frozen in time and can run modern web browsers in a VM....nothing else I need (libreoffice, bluefish, dia etc) will need to stay current.
Just need to get through the next 30 years until I become (more of) a dribbling old fool who cant use a desktop or pop my clogs.
Bluck
"The Reg FOSS desk is nearing 60..."
Let the children play...
X11 over network connection
"The Reg FOSS desk has been installing and supporting Unix boxes since 1988 and has never once needed or used X11 over a network connection."
Until about 6 months ago I'd have been in agreement, but now I find myself in a situation where I need to run some quite complex design software remotely on a cluster in a datacentre & control it from my Windows client machine. Colleagues use various VNC-alike solutions; I run an X11 server on Windows and forward everything, and I have to say it works brilliantly. Far snappier than VNC and allows merging/management of the X application windows alongside the MS Windows ones.
"... but along with blocking his account, as Phoronix reports, the X.org team has been busily reverting lots of his merge requests."
Which seems, on the face of it, petty. If the merge requests were initially accepted, why revert them now? Smacks of Stalinesque "un-personing"; are they also using a scalpel and airbrush Gimp to erase him from all photos?
Ugh. Politics.
Anyway. Thanks for a great article, Liam!